Ajja

The point is not that they must have played in Scotland the point is that in terms of being established players who Aberdeen fans would have thought 'thats a great signing' I don't think Chris Porter, Anthony Stokes, Adam Hammill or Marius Niculae fit into that catagory. They may have turned out to be good signings but then if you are extending the decision making criteria out then our list also gets bigger with the likes of Mulgrew, Aluko and Kerr. My original point was about players who are widely known as being established players by football fans in Scotland. I still stand by the fact that we have signed more of them than anyone else in the last 4 years outside the OF and Hearts (I'm not even sure they have signed many more!). Thereby, we have established ourselves as having a competitive advantage through budget. These guys are not coming to Aberdeen for the sun and multi-culturalism thats for fucking sure.

Thats a pity as we could have done with Aluko being fit for this game.

37 pegs will do nicely

My rational mind tells me that it would be a bad thing for football. My irrational mind (and as a football fan its the one I occupy 100% of the time when I think about football!) says I want to see them fall to pieces in as embarrassing a way I could ever imagine. I have no doubt that Hearts will always be around, they are too big a concern for too many people to go away completely. A short jolt and a 'taking down a peg or two' after the way they have conducted themselves in the last 3 years would be nice.

There is genuine worry among their support at long last. The idea that Romanov will make some sort of sacrafice for the good of the club is laughable. He has never shown any genuine concern for the management of that club and he has carefully crafted a position where the debt is being heaped in a corner of a room in someone elses house. Meanwhile his company are benefiting by being the providers of that debt and gaining interest on it. The problem is that his own little empire that allowed him to carry off this charade has collapsed in the last 6 months and he can no longer bank roll the pantomime that is Hearts. Cash flow is almost always the thing that kills a business and when there is very little liquidity in the financial system and lending has frozen up then cash flow comes to bear on a lot of businesses who are run on credit. Good bye Hearts and we look forward to watching your progress in the 3rd division in about 2011.

I have a feeling that this thread is going to be up top for a while When I spoke to him three weeks ago my 'source' had said that this Friday was likely to be breaking point for the club. Will be interested to find out what happens with this weeks £200K wage bill

Walk away dude. You will never have a reasoned debate with him. It will only make you angry and that can't ever help you unless it causes you to stab him in the neck with a biro at least 28 times.

Even if I accept all of these (which I don't) its still only 3 players to one club at best. I'll see that with at least 5 at Aberdeen - Severin, Miller, Nicholson, MacNamara, Lovell......that's without mentioning Smith !

Well, there is a problem there as the whole idea of this list is that its based on the perception of the person compiling it. Its immediately a subjective exercise which gives it very little value. Hence the reason why I am allowing you the opportunity to expose my own opinion as rubbish knowing I can immediately counter you with the same weight. So best not bother, anyway the lack of a single name to refute my claim has me claiming victory already

I didn't discuss a 'third force' in my opinions (which I am assuming you are responding to) but the wider debate may be down that line. I would disagree with Jamie Smith as he was a pretty accomplished player with Celtic before progressing his career in Holland. You can't include players who turned out to be good, I must insist you apply the discipline of your initial gut reaction when compiling your list. Are you going to do one ?

Who traditionally gets the win bonus ? Do you have to have played in the game or is it paid to the entire squad ?

Only if they keep winning

Or Woolworths

Lets try Calderwoods reign as that is the issue at play and do you really have to ask about Hearts ? Their budget has been more akin to that of the OF in recent times so I don't think the comparison is fair. EDIT: Can we get the top trumps out next ?

Granted, there are players who will go to other clubs rather than us but I would argue that we have seen more established quality players come to Pittodrie in recent years than any other club in the SPL outside of Hearts and the OF. Who are the players that when they signed for UTD, Hibs, Motherwell, Kilmarnock, Falkirk, ICT......you genuinely thought 'thats a great signing I wish Aberdeen had been able to get him'. I can't put a list together that has any of those clubs with a list anything like the one we have.

I read that figure somewhere this week, Scotsman I think. No idea how real it is.

I'm not disagreeing with you and I am certainly not one to hammer home the idea that Calderwood has to go because we aren't always 3rd and winning cups. I personally feel that he has many limitations and that we could potentially be better under different management but I recognise how difficult that is to find and I am still willing to hope he can keep stumbling forward year on year, regardless of how frustrating it can sometimes be. My point is that to say Calderwood has brought back respect and a standard of football that is no longer an embarrassment has to be within the context of a changing league and the competition he is facing. Its easy to say that life is so much better than it was under the previous managers in recent years without understanding the climate. Whether you want to split hairs over the quality you should expect from different budgets which vary very little or not you cannot ignore it as a contributor. With the capture of players like Severin, Jamie Smith, MacNamara and more recently Mark Kerr (who UTD did not want to lose) I think Aberdeen FC have demonstrated that they can attract players from a better pool than most other clubs in the league. So in capturing establised players we have shown we posses a competitive advantage in my mind. However, somewhere in the management of these players or the scouting for uncut diamonds (ie youth) to compliment them we are allowing this position to erode at present. That for me is the glaring defficiency in the current management team at Pittodrie. It doesn't mean I am screaming for change, it does mean I am pragmatic about what we should expect but also what has actually been achieved to date.

Q1. When I was about 7 I had a good friend who I looked up to. He was a passionate Dons fan (I think he was originally from there) and his room was decked in all things red. I guess I was on the look out for a team to settle on and even at that age I was aware that the OF were all you ever saw locally and I was always one for taking the 'road less traveled'. Q2. Abso-fucking-lutely. I remember the day very well. My older brother is also a jambo and the despair in our house (apart from mine and FJ's bedroom ) that afternoon was palpable

Win bonuses are still outstandng from their recent run at £1000 per player per win thats a decent chunk of cash. Winning 5 games on the bounce probably wasn't in their cash flow projections

There are two arguments being used here which have to be linked together. The standard of the league has come down to meet us as much as we have moved up in quality. To state that JC has brought us back to stability and respectability has to be in the context of the quality of our league and the competition within it. I don't disagree that JC has dragged us up to an acceptable standard but you should acknowledge the fact that you are not comparing apples with apples here.

Aye he is up to his knees in it for sure. Personally, I think the club have taken the legs away from underneath him with their approach. With our crippling debt we can't really afford to be turning away good paying customers. The boy should stand up for himself but if he doesn't then I'm sure it will work out and he'll be back on his feet in no time.

What a time that was! Gary Hackett was immense also. I don't really remember my first game but it was def at Tynecastle as FJ says. I thought it was a 1-0 win and we sat at the back of the main stand. Was sometime in the early 80s. For 2-3 years we only ever got to see Aberdeen play Hearts until our Jambo dad took us to Pittodrie and we rinsed them 4-0 and the casuals booted the Yams all the way up and over the broadhill. After that we had to go ourselves, first game without parents was a 2-1 cup victory at Starks Park.

I'd like to see David Murray taking steps to address the issue

We could swap Darren Young for Derek Dods

Lets just shop the person that took the photos of the Motherwell fans being a nuisance. He could get a life ban and then we could all rest easy that the correct and just path had been walked