Hibs Home 03/09

[BigAl]

4 minutes ago, Kowalski said:

Robson’s good will is fast running out. 

100% agree mate.

[OrlandoDon]

And as mentioned the other night, we do look disorganized and are finishing with a front 3 but all are center forwards, two out of position trying to give us width. No right mid option other than Morris or Devlin....worrying.

[BigAl]

Three home games, three defeats.

Goals conceded eight, goals scored two.

Early season optimism well and truly gone.

Next up, our twice annual rimming at Tynecastle and the small matter of a trip to Frankfurt.

Anyone want to buy some flights to Europe ?

[manc_don]

Well that’s a shite result to wake up to.

[redordead]

13 minutes ago, manc_don said:

Well that’s a shite result to wake up to.

At least you didn't have to sit through it

[RicoS321]

Aye, that was bad on the eyes, and I think I got sunburn. Both teams looked like they had played a midweek fixture, a very jaded performance from both sets of players. The conference league is going to be an absolute disaster for us, we're nowhere near it as a squad. We'll be even worse with injuries.

Another disorganised performance, with a setup that doesn't work. Persisted with the number six role, with Barron sitting behind Shinnie and McGrath. Barron was okay (one stupid attempt at a turn aside), Shinnie worked his arse off and McGrath okay. However, it's clear to everyone that we need to play a two behind with one in front. I can only assume Robson thinks that Ramadani is still actually there. It's utterly inexplicable otherwise. Duk should have been hooked after thirty minutes, and certainly after another pathetic dive in the second half. Disgraceful performance. Jensen was decent enough today, but his lack of height is an issue. McGarry wasn't great. Rubezic going off at half time tells us all we need to know about the Serbian Ash. Morris was Morris again, and the other subs were just as clueless as others have mentioned (a 4-3-3 with three number nines is a first for me). Gueye wasn't what I expected at all, he's just exactly the same as Miovski and Sokler (but at least he looks different). He's not that tall, not that fast and looks like he might play on the shoulder. Doesn't look like what we need at all, and have a feeling Robson might just try and shoehorn him in out wide or like he did today. 

Anyway, we were always going to be in the hands of the transfer gods this season. It's frustrating that we've got the wrong types of player in rather than the players being terrible, it feels like that shouldn't happen.

[Panda]

I think Robson's problem is he's trying to play last season's 3-5-2 with a different set of players and isn't getting the same success.

At the moment (and it's early and these things can change)

Scales > Jensen

Pollock > Rubezic

Ramadani > Polvara

McCrorie - Devlin

Hayes - McGarry

Devlin the best of the new signings, but I don't think 3-5-2 is working for him. Because if he plays RWB, we seem to lack a lot of pace down the right. If we play him in the three to play Morris, then we play a guy who can't defend as a wing back.

I'd play a four at the back with Shinnie and Clarkson as a two in midfield, get McGrath in front of them, and play Polvara as a defensive mid who can drop into defence to make it a three if need be.

Means the team lacks width, but Hayes and Morris appear to be the only wingers anyway.

 

[RicoS321]

31 minutes ago, Panda said:

I'd play a four at the back with Shinnie and Clarkson as a two in midfield, get McGrath in front of them, and play Polvara as a defensive mid who can drop into defence to make it a three if need be.

What in the world is this? You were doing well(ish) until you suggested Polvara. A 4-1-2-1-2? That's definitely not a thing. Not even Craig Levein would attempt that. 

Just keep it simple with a 4-2-3-1. Play Miovski and apologise to the other three for having wasted their time. Shinnie and Barron sitting, Clarkson in front. If you want to get defensive, then play McGrath in one of the wide spots in the three, otherwise it's Duncan and a lamppost. Tell Duk to come back when he's finished giving the ball away in our own half.

[dons8321]

5 hours ago, OrlandoDon said:

And as mentioned the other night, we do look disorganized and are finishing with a front 3 but all are center forwards, two out of position trying to give us width. No right mid option other than Morris or Devlin....worrying.

Thought Morris had his best game for us...came on, only twice lost his man, got in 1 good cross and then got injured (hopefully not trivial) and was subbed off all in 15 mins. 

Just really pissed off tonight. 

[Panda]

54 minutes ago, RicoS321 said:

What in the world is this? You were doing well(ish) until you suggested Polvara. A 4-1-2-1-2? That's definitely not a thing. Not even Craig Levein would attempt that. 
 

A diamond midfield is very much a thing. Especially when you lack wide players and want to play two up front.

54 minutes ago, RicoS321 said:

 

Just keep it simple with a 4-2-3-1. Play Miovski and apologise to the other three for having wasted their time. Shinnie and Barron sitting, Clarkson in front. 

So play Clarkson as a 10, which Goodwin tried to do and failed with?

[OrlandoDon]

Interesting comments. I actually think that Jensen is decent, small sample size but I’m ok there. Mcgarry too. Think devlin was poor today because of their left winger and his pace, I don’t think devlin wanted to bomb on knowing ruby would and did struggle behind him. Without the right wing back going forward we have nothing on the right, and it showed. Agree on the morris comments, he looked ok for 5 mins but I don’t think it’s unfair to say that you get 5 decent minutes per game from morris. Plus I’m sure he was given the freedom to go forward that devlin didn’t in the first half.

we’ll get killed in midfield unless we sign an out of contract free agent. We have zero physical presence. Shinnie works, clarkson flair, but neither is a physical presence. Rama brought physicality and a presence. I just cannot believe for a Scottish league team we are going with this type of midfield. 
blew my mind that we play gueye , signed for a different look up top, wide left. Not what I expected at all.

worrying day.  I can accept struggling against a different look in Europe, but to see that against a bottom of the league hibs, not good.

[RicoS321]

8 hours ago, Panda said:

So play Clarkson as a 10, which Goodwin tried to do and failed with?

Goodwin played Ramadani as a sitting midfielder with Clarkson and another ahead in a 3-1-4-2. When he played Ramadani in a two (with Barron) with Clarkson in front we were generally good. Being Goodwin, he didn't repeat his successes. He regularly played a flat three against better teams. Clarkson has shown on numerous occasions that he can play the 10 role. Whether he's playing 6 or 10 (he needs to be in the one, because his left and right movement is key), the important thing is that there are two other players doing the dirty work. Last season we had just Ramadani, when Goodwin was here, this season we've repeated the mistake with just Shinnie. Clarkson is basically a Kenny McLean type, he can play behind the strikers or the midfield, his thing being lightening quick passing and vision. Robson has switched him between the two positions already in games this season.

Edit: to be honest, it's so important to Clarkson's game and thus our team, that I'd even consider putting Devlin into the other Shinnie role to see if he can do a job. I thought Barron did well enough against Hibs (we got much worse when he went off), but he suffers from the same problems as Clarkson.

Edited September 4, 2023 by RicoS321

[OrlandoDon]

5 hours ago, RicoS321 said:

Goodwin played Ramadani as a sitting midfielder with Clarkson and another ahead in a 3-1-4-2. When he played Ramadani in a two (with Barron) with Clarkson in front we were generally good. Being Goodwin, he didn't repeat his successes. He regularly played a flat three against better teams. Clarkson has shown on numerous occasions that he can play the 10 role. Whether he's playing 6 or 10 (he needs to be in the one, because his left and right movement is key), the important thing is that there are two other players doing the dirty work. Last season we had just Ramadani, when Goodwin was here, this season we've repeated the mistake with just Shinnie. Clarkson is basically a Kenny McLean type, he can play behind the strikers or the midfield, his thing being lightening quick passing and vision. Robson has switched him between the two positions already in games this season.

Edit: to be honest, it's so important to Clarkson's game and thus our team, that I'd even consider putting Devlin into the other Shinnie role to see if he can do a job. I thought Barron did well enough against Hibs (we got much worse when he went off), but he suffers from the same problems as Clarkson.

Ha, here we go. Square peg round hole. I also thought that yesterday too, move devlin into center mid alongside shinnie. Didn’t think Barron was bad yesterday, we just miss Rama’s drive, physicality, and effort, and devlin may be our best option. That’s not Barron, polvara, McGrath, or clarkson. It’s one of these four plus shinnie and a.n. Other. The downside to moving devlin is who do you play at right wing back. Means morris plays unfortunately. Highlights our bizarre summer window, we needed a Rama replacement and someone better than morris to back up devlin. I honestly prefer Richardson over morris.

[Tyrant]

20 hours ago, BigAl said:

Three home games, three defeats.

Goals conceded eight, goals scored two.

Early season optimism well and truly gone.

Next up, our twice annual rimming at Tynecastle and the small matter of a trip to Frankfurt.

Anyone want to buy some flights to Europe ?

Luckily there plenty to do in Frankfurt asides fitba. 

[BigAl]

1 hour ago, Tyrant said:

Luckily there plenty to do in Frankfurt asides fitba. 

[Panda]

5 hours ago, OrlandoDon said:

The downside to moving devlin is who do you play at right wing back. Means morris plays unfortunately. Highlights our bizarre summer window, we needed a Rama replacement and someone better than morris to back up devlin. I honestly prefer Richardson over morris.

Or Dadia?

 

[KGB]

35 minutes ago, Panda said:

Or Dadia?

 

Does he even exist?

[Elgindon]

If we stick with the 3 at the back,why not try Or dadia in the Rama role......or could Duncan even be moulded into the same role? He's got the physical attributes,we seem to be struggling to find his best position otherwise

    If we eventually switch to a 4,does that still require a Rama type,or something different?

[manc_don]

Or Dadia has to be really pish if we’ve not even seen a glimpse of him. 

[Panda]

Should also be said, Gartenmann can also play right back if we wanted to play a four. 

[RicoS321]

36 minutes ago, Elgindon said:

If we stick with the 3 at the back,why not try Or dadia in the Rama role......or could Duncan even be moulded into the same role? He's got the physical attributes,we seem to be struggling to find his best position otherwise

    If we eventually switch to a 4,does that still require a Rama type,or something different?

There's always one signing that you never see anything, or little, of. Roberts last season springs to mind (although there were a number of contenders). I'm guessing that Dadia and Williams might fall into that. He's been deemed not good enough to displace Morris at wing back, so he's clearly not setting the heather alight in training.

Duncan, for me, doesn't really fit into our setup at all (I acutally think he'd be best suited to being the central player behind the striker in a 4-2-3-1). He doesn't have the physical attributes of Ramadani anymore than Polvara does. Ramadani wasn't a defensive midfielder, he was basically like a less aggressive version of Shinnie, going from box to box, disrupting play and occasionally doing something good with the ball too. Fitness, workrate and determination were his key attributes. Devlin, perhaps even Hayes, are the closest we've got to those attributes in the squad. If we're not going to try either of those two (and I'm not really suggesting we should), then Robson urgently needs to change system.

[RicoS321]

8 minutes ago, Panda said:

Should also be said, Gartenmann can also play right back if we wanted to play a four. 

That'd certainly be the sensible approach (playing a four). It doesn't seem like Robson's taking note though does it? With two weeks until our next fixture, do you reckon Robson will be trying to coach us in a four and play to our strengths, or stubbornly coaching the art of the shoehorn in order to maintain his system?

[OrlandoDon]

2 hours ago, RicoS321 said:

That'd certainly be the sensible approach (playing a four). It doesn't seem like Robson's taking note though does it? With two weeks until our next fixture, do you reckon Robson will be trying to coach us in a four and play to our strengths, or stubbornly coaching the art of the shoehorn in order to maintain his system?

Pretty sure you know the answer to your own question, and given the window has just closed I don’t see us moving on from a 3-5-2 just yet. We went all in on the transfer market playing 3-5-2 and signed for that formation. I think over the next two weeks Robson will try to determine who our back 3 is - i’d say it’s Jensen-Macdonald and one other, but other than that, I think the team picks itself in robson’s eyes, and he’s got two weeks to work with the majority of the squad. 

roos

x - Macdonald Jensen

devlin clarkson shinnie mcgarry

mcgrath

miovski duk
 

I don’t think we have the squad to play a 4 at the back, we don’t have a strong enough midfield, one of the reasons we’re the 3 at the back. We don’t have two strong central players, and have no right mid. 

id like us to see where the new boy fits in. If gartenmann can play right wing back move devlin to center mid, or vice versa if gartenmann can play mid (unlikely, never seen that said anywhere. ) with gartenmann or ruby on the right of the three I’d like to see devlin or or dadia at center mid and right wing back, don’t care which is where, but from what we’ve seen of late we’re a mess in midfield and something needs to change. The strength and athleticism of Rama and mccrorie helped us, I think we try to replicate that. Or dadia was said to be a right back/wing back/center mid, and given what we’ve witnessed the last few weeks doesn’t hurt to try him. Given how shit Morris is, surely we give dadia some minutes.

it’s bad squad construction, I feel we can’t play more than one of Barron clarkson McGrath, and polvara. I also think we went 3-5-2 to accommodate duk, we’re a little fucked if he doesn't find form. I think sokler is miovski’s back up and needs to be played in that role when he plays. Given where gueye played yesterday, no clue what type of players he is…??

[Jute]

Interestingly both Rubi and Jensen came from teams that play with a back 4 so we maybe do have the players to go to a 4 at the back. However agree that midfield would still be an issue.

[RicoS321]

1 hour ago, Jute said:

Interestingly both Rubi and Jensen came from teams that play with a back 4 so we maybe do have the players to go to a 4 at the back. However agree that midfield would still be an issue.

We've definitely got the back four, and I'd argue that if Barron and Shinnie were sitting in a two in front, we can work with that.