X

[rocket_scientist]

Please present us with his business record.

 

At the time he took Milne's offer as DoF, his business at Ramsdens was failing and subsequently failed, causing many unpaid creidtors. This was relevant, his failing business at that time, because it made Miller vulnerable to accepting the income on offer, and turning his own AFC-critic position inside out. Every healthy "democracy" acknowledges the role of an opposition. We've had none since Miller turned coats. 

[rocket_scientist]

As for the moving forward - that's a load of c*ck. It doesn't matter a f*ck what any of us fans think - until we have some proper say at the club - instead of buying diddy shares that matter not a f*ck, we would all have been better putting that money and some serious organisation towards getting the club into fans control and telling Milne to GTF.

 

It appears that we agree on the whole. You are also right in that it doesn't matter what we think at present, although incredibly, some think everything in the garden is still rosy. I do not think telling Milne to GTF is a relevant discussion, because he has engineered himself into a position of dependence and has assumed total control. What is more relevant is getting him to understand that he can not continue to abdicate his responsibility by leaving Miller and Calderwood in charge of the football side of the business, because it won't get any better under their charge.

 

We disagree on whether the manager is inept, yet you acknowledge the very poor nature of our squad, and share my concerns for any hope of progress in the near or mid term future. You also point out that our only asset, Pittodrie, is now part of TallTray, a commercial arrangement entered into for tax advantages presumably, although it is still counted in the fixed assets on the AFC plc balance sheet, therefore the shareholding of TallTray may be that it is a wholly owned subsidiary. I couldn't be arsed looking up the accounts from last year to know for sure, but it is not relevant to the point. In fact, by our only asset not being under AFC plc control, if this was the case, would actually make it worse, and gives further strength to the fans who are right to express concerns with the mismanagement at the club.

 

As for labouring under the impression that supporters are customers or fans etc., I don't really understand your point, although I do agree with you that we desperately need to establish some sort of dialogue. Milne hasn't taken the opportunity to address fans once since Miller was appointed, and if he has, once, then I missed it. His conduct at the AGM's suggest he really doen't care or want to know what we think. The PR, you call spin. Exactly. They have often spun expectations as an excuse for non achievement.

[mizer]

fars the clocks!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[TENEMENTFUNSTER]

What are your solutions though midlife?

 

Assuming of course that we all agree on your overview of the problems.

[???]

At the time he took Milne's offer as DoF, his business at Ramsdens was failing and subsequently failed, causing many unpaid creidtors.

 

 

This man knows it all.

[rocket_scientist]

What are your solutions though midlife?

 

Assuming of course that we all agree on your overview of the problems.

 

I note you haven't had the balls to agree or disagree with my overview, and just ask for solutions. What makes you think I would be qualified?

 

As I said all along, there has to be a majority concensus on the problems before any discussion on the solutions. In this, your forum is unique in that a number of posters deny the reality of that problems exist. Whatever your reasons for denial, who knows and who cares?

 

But unlike you, I won't run from the debate and sit on the fence.

 

Levy had a problem with Ramos. Murray had a problem with PLG. We have a problem with Miller & Calderwood. What they did, was to identify the problem and act behind the scenes to line up a successor, get agreement in principle from that successor, then axe the problem.

 

Milne has been inactive to date. For 4.5 years he has presided over this decline. If he shared the majority of fans view, that Calderwood is not the man to take us forward, then he should have resisted the 3 year contract extension. The club should be active lining up a better manager, like Rangers and Spurs did. That's if the club shares the same view of the problem as the fans do.

 

The solution, for Milne personally, is to get a non-inept, non-fat bastard in charge of the football team, and revert to a traditional management style - like Levy said today - to repair the damage of the last x years. The crowds are disappearing, and by binning Miller and Calderwood, and getting someone competent in, will give us all a massive injection of fresh hope, and new-found respect for Milne. He is overdue keeping to his promise that the product/football will always be his priority.

 

If you ask me to say who should be the next manager, I would say that none of us are qualified to say. We don't work in football. We don't know who might, or might not, be available. If we did work in football, in that capacity for AFC, we would have had the feelers out well before now though. It's not working, and needs surgery. Like Spurs fans today, and RFC fans when they took the Scotland manager back to Ibrox, we deserve to wake up one day and find the common problem has been removed, and a solution already in place. That day is well overdue. If the problem is agreed, then pressure can be brought to bear to force the chairman to exerise the solution, which is the replacement of our management team in charge of "football affairs". If he fails to act, again, then he becomes the principal problem requiring of a new solution but that is for another day. He has ignored us for 4.5 years and has left the failing management team of Miller and Calderwood in charge. It's high time he acted. The crowds and potential future income for this club are screaming for change.

[Kowalski]

The solution, for Milne personally, is to get a non-inept, non-fat bastard in charge of the football team

 

That rules Martin Jol out then. 

[Kowalski]

At the time he took Milne's offer as DoF, his business at Ramsdens was failing and subsequently failed, causing many unpaid creidtors. This was relevant, his failing business at that time, because it made Miller vulnerable to accepting the income on offer, and turning his own AFC-critic position inside out. Every healthy "democracy" acknowledges the role of an opposition. We've had none since Miller turned coats. 

 

Was this not down to a fire?

 

[TENEMENTFUNSTER]

You say you are not qualified to decide who should be in charge but seem over-qualified about who shouldn't.

 

What makes you think you are qualified to decide who shouldn't be in charge?

[rocket_scientist]

there was debt prior to Dick Donald coming in... he got rid of it.

 

Yes, you are right. He got rid of a £37k debt or something, I believe. I read that this weekend for the first time. Not quite in the same league, but my point was that the building of the RDS put us £2m in debt, despite the grants we got. Milne used his creditor position to lever himself on to the board. The financial record since then speaks for itself.

[rocket_scientist]

Was this not down to a fire?

 

 

A well-timed fire, allegedly. The business was losing and had lost shed-loads of money before the fire.

[rocket_scientist]

You say you are not qualified to decide who should be in charge but seem over-qualified about who shouldn't.

 

What makes you think you are qualified to decide who shouldn't be in charge?

 

The facts are facts. It is my opinion that Calderwood should go. Of course I don't see the valuable, ingenious contributions he makes on the training ground, but I see the results of his labours on a Saturday and based on the alarming declining numbers of people coming through the gate, and his total inability to deliver anything better than entrenched mediocrity for over 4 years now, then you will not be surprised that my opinion is not exclusive - this is the opinion of many.

 

Assuming we ae all Aberdeen fans all sharing the same objective, then do you agree? Perhaps Jimmy and Miller are right, eh? Maybe my expectations are too high? Maybe what you're watching is satisfactory, and I should be satisfied too?

 

You try to make it a personal issue with smart ass comments and twists, yet you spectacularly ignore the debate. Does this reveal your priority, and your real objectives for posting on an internet forum that carries an AFC badge? Or, like many think, is the fortunes of AFC not the real priority?

[rocket_scientist]

If you recall what things were like under patterson then things have improved under calderwood. We don't have the revenue of spurs or rangers and would find it difficult to get a manager better than calderwood.

 

This is an oft-trotted out argument, the comparison between JC and the previously under-performing managers. I don't think it's relevant. Of course JC's top 6 record is better than Alex Miller, Ebbe and Paterson - all Milne appointments. This is obvious. But do you really think Calderwood is the limit of our recruitment capability? I don't. Strachan and McLeish were unemployed during the period we've been labouring with this bumbling idiot, both of whom I think would have taken us further than where we are now, or likely to ever get to under this inept fool.

 

On the qualification point TF raises, we are allowed to have impressions and opinions on people, when we read and hear what they say surely? My impressions on Calderwood the man are inclined towards the negative, not the positive. My impressions on his football management ability are also inclined to the wrong side of neutral based on many years now. Am I qualified to have an opinion? Based on my experience, I think I am. Whether my opinion is right or wrong, only time will tell, but my opinion is shared by the majority of Dons fans in the real world, and on the supposedly racist site.

 

Do any of you see anything in my posts to agree with? Or are you more interested in other dynamics on here?

 

[TENEMENTFUNSTER]

The facts are facts. It is my opinion that Calderwood should go. Of course I don't see the valuable, ingenious contributions he makes on the training ground, but I see the results of his labours on a Saturday and based on the alarming declining numbers of people coming through the gate, and his total inability to deliver anything better than entrenched mediocrity for over 4 years now, then you will not be surprised that my opinion is not exclusive - this is the opinion of many.

 

Assuming we ae all Aberdeen fans all sharing the same objective, then do you agree? Perhaps Jimmy and Miller are right, eh? Maybe my expectations are too high? Maybe what you're watching is satisfactory, and I should be satisfied too?

 

You try to make it a personal issue with smart ass comments and twists, yet you spectacularly ignore the debate. Does this reveal your priority, and your real objectives for posting on an internet forum that carries an AFC badge? Or, like many think, is the fortunes of AFC not the real priority?

 

The fact is that your opinion is he should go. Pretty far from a fact.

 

Obviously my motives are in question, I'm not for changing the manager, not right now.

 

You want rid of everyone and have a seemingly overly personal issue with the director of football.

 

I think the motives you have presented are more in question, as is your ability to pass judgement on the "facts".

[Kowalski]

The facts are facts.

 

Come back when you've got some facts, not opinions! 

[rocket_scientist]

I even have my doubts as to whether you are a fan - or whether you are the supporter of another club just trying to stir up shite - maybe even on the payroll of the Daily Record.

 

From a known hater of North East people, as evidenced by your posts depicting us as apes, I find this tragically comic.

[rocket_scientist]

I'm not for changing the manager, not right now.

 

I respect that you have a different opinion but I don't understand what you see in Calderwood that justifies your position.

 

But after that other twat's equally supportive position towards our inept manager, I despair of your collective inability to see the reality.

 

What the fuck have you cunts been watching these last 4.5 and last dozen years? Me no understandy. Me no longer carey. You no real.

[BobbyBiscuit]

From a known hater of North East people, as evidenced by your posts depicting us as apes, I find this tragically comic.

 

EPIC FAIL.

[TENEMENTFUNSTER]

Twats? Cunts? Reality?

 

The last 4 and a half years have been light years away from the previous 7. Had Milne NOT made such a hash of appointments up to that point maybe things would be different, maybe not.

 

Milne financially backed his appointments but used the clubs cash to back them. I have serious doubts about this man's commitment to AFC in every sense. A man who could at a whim, wipe out all of his financial misdemeanors at AFC but he definitely will not and we are completely landed with him.

 

I do however have no doubts about where Miller's commitment lie. Might be romanticised nonsense but he at least seems concerned with his integrity with AFC fans.

[rocket_scientist]

The last 4 and a half years have been light years away from the previous 7. Had Milne NOT made such a hash of appointments up to that point maybe things would be different, maybe not. AGREE

 

Milne financially backed his appointments but used the clubs cash to back them. OUR MONEY

 

I have serious doubts about this man's commitment to AFC in every sense. AGREE

 

A man who could at a whim, wipe out all of his financial misdemeanors at AFC but he definitely will not and we are completely landed with him. UNLESS HE EITHER COMMITS TO THE COMMITMENT HE GAVE US 12 YEARS AGO, OR MAKES IT KNOWN HE WANTS OUT

 

I do however have no doubts about where Miller's commitment lie. AGREE

 

Might be romanticised nonsense but he at least seems concerned with his integrity with AFC fans. NOT SURE ABOUT THAT

 

Intelligent post, in keeping with the most intelligent posters are on this site line, which I was fed when I first discovered DT.

 

Jager, speaking of tragic, who's the one getting all het up with a stranger on tinternet? You're a fucking beaut.

 

Boaby, you are the dead fingernail on the shirt-tail under the coat of action.

[Kowalski]

What the fuck have you cunts been watching these last 4.5 and last dozen years?

 

The last 4.5 years have been far better than what's gone before for a long time.  That said, it may still be time for a change of manager but not quite yet for me anyway.

[rocket_scientist]

The last 4.5 years have been far better than what's gone before for a long time.  That said, it may still be time for a change of manager but not quite yet for me anyway.

 

Yes, but the Alex Miller, Ebbe and Paterson era's were so bad, such poor Milne appointments, that comparison with them fails to see our potential.

 

If you do not think that JC should go now, then you see sufficient positive attributes in the man to justify any further delay in his disposal.

 

Time will tell if you are right. I think it's been long enough, and I think we are best placed ripping it up and starting again. The man is a complete arse.

[minijc]

Thanks fucker! Hope ye get aids 

:lolabove:

[Kowalski]

Yes, but the Alex Miller, Ebbe and Paterson era's were so bad, such poor Milne appointments, that comparison with them fails to see our potential.

 

If you do not think that JC should go now, then you see sufficient positive attributes in the man to justify any further delay in his disposal.

 

Time will tell if you are right. I think it's been long enough, and I think we are best placed ripping it up and starting again. The man is a complete arse.

 

You clearly have too high expectations.

 

Too expensive to sack JC just now IMHO and I don't know who we would replace him with at the moment who would be willing to come, or we could afford.

[rocket_scientist]

You clearly have too high expectations.

 

Too expensive to sack JC just now IMHO and I don't know who we would replace him with at the moment who would be willing to come, or we could afford.

 

Clearly. Compared to your minority view of what our expectations should be.

 

For a club that can justify spending £600K on a feasibility study when the simple finances don't stack up, even if we did get more than double the mooted £8m potential from the public sector, then getting rid of JC is a far less risky proposition. He would walk for £100k/£150k if forced to. This represents an extra 2,000/3,000 fans for 2 home games only. You do the maths.