glasgow sheep Posted February 19, 2009 Report Posted February 19, 2009 SPL expansion plan given approval The Scottish Premier League is a step closer to creating a second division - two and a half years after first proposing it. The Scottish Football League had contested a bid to introduce an SPL2, claiming it would breach a previous agreement between the two bodies. But the Scottish FA's arbitration panel concluded on Thursday that a second tier would not breach the agreement. "We welcome this outcome," said SPL executive chairman Lex Gold. "It has taken quite some time to arrive at this conclusion. "But the way is now clear for us to review this outcome with our clubs after which we will have discussions with our colleagues in the SFL. "Our aim through all of this has been to enhance and strengthen the senior professional game in Scotland." The proposal for a new top-flight structure of 22 clubs playing in two divisions was first introduced in 2006. But the SFL challenged the proposal, insisting it would break a settlement agreement which was reached when the SPL was first set up in 1998. That settlement agreement detailed issues such as promotion, relegation and parachute payments. The independent panel that was appointed to assess the SFL's claim of a possible breach included Hon Lord Brodie, PricewaterhouseCoopers' David Glen and Jim Clydesdale. The SPL say they will convene an extraordinary meeting of its 12 clubs in mid-March to ask them if they still back the creation of an SPL2. If that's successful, the SPL will then open negotiations with the SFL. What the fuck is the point in this? I don't really see what extra cash the 10 first division clubs will attract to the kitty, and even if they did, presumably it would result in the usual OF getting much the same and the rest getting split between 20 clubs instead of 10. I suppose it gives them scope to fuck about with the league structure again, but I guess it is more likely to go back to a top 10 so they can get rid of the split and then a 44 game 1st division. Will presumably totally wreck division 2 and 3, which may not be a terrible thing, but given that SPL2 will have entry requirements I guess it won't be long before we stop seeing promotion for good. What actually needs to happen is that the SPL is disbanded and the arrogant self interested wankers that run it told to fuck off. The SFL shut down and the SFA grow some balls, stand up to the old firm, and actually do some good for the game rather than fucking it up or standing back trying to ignore it......ha some chance. Quote
TENEMENTFUNSTER Posted February 19, 2009 Report Posted February 19, 2009 No point at all. One thing though which might be good, it further reduces the influence and responsibility of the SFL and maybe it will negate the need for it.. There are 3 institutions running fitba, it barely needs one. Quote
glasgow sheep Posted February 19, 2009 Author Report Posted February 19, 2009 No point at all. One thing though which might be good, it further reduces the influence and responsibility of the SFL and maybe it will negate the need for it.. There are 3 institutions running fitba, it barely needs one. true, although I'm not sure that the SFL have much influence these days, and any they do is going to be used in a more egalitarian way the SPL. The SFA should be the sole instution running the game (although admittedly the thought of Smith and Peat having even more control over the game is fucking petrifying) Quote
TENEMENTFUNSTER Posted February 19, 2009 Report Posted February 19, 2009 true, although I'm not sure that the SFL have much influence these days, and any they do is going to be used in a more egalitarian way the SPL. The SFA should be the sole instution running the game (although admittedly the thought of Smith and Peat having even more control over the game is fucking petrifying) The SFL don't have much influence I guess, other than running/administrating 3 of the 4 senior leagues and one of the 2 cup competitions. The SFA and SPL have never given any inkling that they are fit to run a menage but I would have though only having one body for the running and administrating the game would be far better, cheaper and more accountable than it currently is. Quote
kelt Posted February 19, 2009 Report Posted February 19, 2009 Scottish Premier League 2 How could it be premier? This is maybe another step towards the Special Olympicising of Scottish Fitba. Everyone gets to be a winner... if you don't win the SPL then you might still win a cup or the Bottom 6 league. Now you've also got the chance of winning the SPL2! You don't get to boo the players because it might upset them. You don't get to throw bog rolls because it might startle our special little players, and make them flee into the advertising boards like terrified, retarded gazelles. You don't get to wave banners criticising the team because most fitba players can't read, and those that can will start crying and refuse to come out for the second half. You don't get to stand up, because our players don't understand perspective, and might think they're surrounded by thousands of giants, and terrify them to the point of pissing/shitting their adult nappies. You don't get to take pictures because you might accidentally get a copper in the shot and have to go to jail... ...what was the question again? Quote
TENEMENTFUNSTER Posted February 19, 2009 Report Posted February 19, 2009 This is maybe another step towards the Special Olympicising of Scottish Fitba. Everyone gets to be a winner... if you don't win the SPL then you might still win a cup or the Bottom 6 league. Now you've also got the chance of winning the SPL2! You don't get to boo the players because it might upset them. You don't get to throw bog rolls because it might startle our special little players, and make them flee into the advertising boards like terrified, retarded gazelles. You don't get to wave banners criticising the team because most fitba players can't read, and those that can will start crying and refuse to come out for the second half. You don't get to stand up, because our players don't understand perspective, and might think they're surrounded by thousands of giants, and terrify them to the point of pissing/shitting their adult nappies. You don't get to take pictures because you might accidentally get a copper in the shot and have to go to jail... ...what was the question again? Quote
KGB Posted February 19, 2009 Report Posted February 19, 2009 This is maybe another step towards the Special Olympicising of Scottish Fitba. Everyone gets to be a winner... if you don't win the SPL then you might still win a cup or the Bottom 6 league. Now you've also got the chance of winning the SPL2! You don't get to boo the players because it might upset them. You don't get to throw bog rolls because it might startle our special little players, and make them flee into the advertising boards like terrified, retarded gazelles. You don't get to wave banners criticising the team because most fitba players can't read, and those that can will start crying and refuse to come out for the second half. You don't get to stand up, because our players don't understand perspective, and might think they're surrounded by thousands of giants, and terrify them to the point of pissing/shitting their adult nappies. You don't get to take pictures because you might accidentally get a copper in the shot and have to go to jail... ...what was the question again? The question is irrelevant as your rant is spot on Quote
Reekie_Red Posted February 20, 2009 Report Posted February 20, 2009 I think SPL2 may just be a working-title for the new league. With the SPL governing chaps running the two leagues, there's big scope for a return to either relegation playoffs or even two automatic relegation spots from the SPL1. Now THAT would fuck with the likes of Motherwell, Kilmarnock and Falkirk! Scottish football needs a shakeup, in my opinion. It's stale. It's boring. It's predictable. Gradually easing one of the governing bodies away from a position of power is only going to do the game good. And for that body to be the SFL, it's got to be good for the future of the game. On a side note, I can't see what the creation of an SPL2 is going to do to benefit the Old Firm, so don't really see any problem with it. Quote
glasgow sheep Posted February 20, 2009 Author Report Posted February 20, 2009 I think SPL2 may just be a working-title for the new league. With the SPL governing chaps running the two leagues, there's big scope for a return to either relegation playoffs or even two automatic relegation spots from the SPL1. Now THAT would fuck with the likes of Motherwell, Kilmarnock and Falkirk! Scottish football needs a shakeup, in my opinion. It's stale. It's boring. It's predictable. Gradually easing one of the governing bodies away from a position of power is only going to do the game good. And for that body to be the SFL, it's got to be good for the future of the game. On a side note, I can't see what the creation of an SPL2 is going to do to benefit the Old Firm, so don't really see any problem with it. The whole point of SPL2 is to stop money being "wasted" on the wee, part-time clubs in the bottom two divisions. Entry requirements will mean that essentially a closed shop of 22 will be set up who get all of the money from TV and sponsorship rather than just the vast majority. The league cup will be scrapped and replaced by an SPL cup, but apart from that fuck all will change for the likes of us. It will do nothing to improve Scottish Football, will likely make it even more dull and predictable and will only succeed in shutting down a few wee clubs that aren't doing anyone any harm. We will be left with 22 senior clubs, with a more thinly spread pot of cash while the OF continue to get the lions share. How long before folk are moaning about the fact that there is no new blood coming into the the SPL2, and complaining about the monotony of it all? The 1st division clubs are desperately clutching at this as a way to get more money and to protect them from falling into the bottom two leagues. In reality it won't give them much more and will commit them to ground improvements, full time set ups and reserve (or u19) squads that they won't be able to afford. No shock that that twat Yorkston is leading the way trying to grab a few extra sheckls in the short term, while ignoring the long term Quote
dave_min Posted February 20, 2009 Report Posted February 20, 2009 Couldn't we just get an SPL with say 20ish teams in it, or is that too much to ask for* (* yes, I know it's too much to ask for) Quote
Kowalski Posted February 20, 2009 Report Posted February 20, 2009 Couldn't we just get an SPL with say 20ish teams in it, or is that too much to ask for* (* yes, I know it's too much to ask for) I'd definitely be up for an expansion of the SPL. The top six split is shite, and too many teams are involved in relegation fights each season. A league of 16, 18 or 20 would do for me! Quote
kelt Posted February 20, 2009 Report Posted February 20, 2009 I'd definitely be up for an expansion of the SPL. The top six split is shite, and too many teams are involved in relegation fights each season. A league of 16, 18 or 20 would do for me! I don't care how many teams are in a new SPL format, so long as the OF aren't part of it. All I know is I hate those cunts. Quote
octavion Posted February 20, 2009 Report Posted February 20, 2009 I like the idea of a bigger SPL too. But reality is it will probably never happen Quote
Harcus Posted February 21, 2009 Report Posted February 21, 2009 Sort out the top 20/22/24 into some kind of two league system - one up, one down, with a play off featuring second bottom SPL, second placed SPL2. Regionalise everything below SPL2, pyramid system. Quote
Harcus Posted February 21, 2009 Report Posted February 21, 2009 and still play a club 4 times in a season? with the possibility of playing 6 or more times in a season? That's radical forward thinking And your solution? I don't think there are enough quality teams in Scotland to sustain a top league of 18 or 20. Yeah, we'd only be playing each other twice a season, but imagine the vast number of teams playing for fuck all (read: not get relegated) between 4th and bottom. The split/12 team league gets a lot of criticism, but I feel it is the best solution at this time for Scottish football. Quote
dickofthedons Posted February 21, 2009 Report Posted February 21, 2009 Isnt that the same in all leagues with 18-20 teams?? If it were to happen then the teams coming up would be able to attract slightly better players. Most of the teams that would come up have been in the SPL in the last 10-15 years anyway. Teams like Dundee, Dunfermline, Livi, St Johnstone etc isnt gonna make the league anymore embarrassing as it is just now. Quote
kelt Posted February 21, 2009 Report Posted February 21, 2009 Typical lack of imagination.. solve the problem by throwing a bunch of shitty teams into the mix and see how a 20 team league works. Scottish fitba needs to be ripped apart and put back together again. Personally I like the idea of seperate leagues. Maybe an East and West Coast league (something that has been suggested before). The West Coast league might initially have more cash, but it'll also get to keep all the sectarianism. The East Coast league is going to be more competitive, with most of the clubs in with a realistic chance of winning something. A more competitive league is going to draw in more crowds, which means an East Coast league should be able to generate enough revenue to keep its teams at least as financially sound as they are now, even with the loss of the OF's dirty money. Cups could be inter league, meaning ALL the teams go into one unseeded pot. Winners of the East and West Coast leagues would go into the Champions League, runners up/cup winners could go into whatever the lesser Euro competition is at the time. This means it's not ALWAYS the Huns and Tims in the CL, which means increased revenue for clubs like Aberdeen or United when they play clubs like Milan or Barca. There may be problems with this, and the main one I can see is the OF would be fucking horrified at the prospect of other clubs getting into the CL, which is a good enough reason to go for it as far as I'm concerned. Thoughts? Quote
Huck the Funs Posted February 22, 2009 Report Posted February 22, 2009 I'd go for a 16 team league... scrap the league cup... have scottish cup games played as a home and away leg like in Italy. then the side that got relegated one year would come straight back up the next Quote
Harcus Posted February 22, 2009 Report Posted February 22, 2009 I'd go for a 16 team league... scrap the league cup... have scottish cup games played as a home and away leg like in Italy. So thirty league games a season? With the possibility of only playing two Scottish Cup games? That's not enough football my friend. Quote
tlg1903 Posted February 23, 2009 Report Posted February 23, 2009 Typical lack of imagination.. solve the problem by throwing a bunch of shitty teams into the mix and see how a 20 team league works. Scottish fitba needs to be ripped apart and put back together again. Personally I like the idea of seperate leagues. Maybe an East and West Coast league (something that has been suggested before). The West Coast league might initially have more cash, but it'll also get to keep all the sectarianism. The East Coast league is going to be more competitive, with most of the clubs in with a realistic chance of winning something. A more competitive league is going to draw in more crowds, which means an East Coast league should be able to generate enough revenue to keep its teams at least as financially sound as they are now, even with the loss of the OF's dirty money. Cups could be inter league, meaning ALL the teams go into one unseeded pot. Winners of the East and West Coast leagues would go into the Champions League, runners up/cup winners could go into whatever the lesser Euro competition is at the time. This means it's not ALWAYS the Huns and Tims in the CL, which means increased revenue for clubs like Aberdeen or United when they play clubs like Milan or Barca. There may be problems with this, and the main one I can see is the OF would be fucking horrified at the prospect of other clubs getting into the CL, which is a good enough reason to go for it as far as I'm concerned. Thoughts? that is a really interesting idea kelt. It will never fly under the current rules cos as you say the old firm would not have their CL carrot and would therefore stand together and veto it. east coast league sounds pretty good as your pretty much getting the best of the spl outwith the gruesome twosome. West coast league sounds shite though. OF, falkirk, st mirren, killie, minkerwell, hamilton, morton, partick and ayr. would be boring as hell. I think the most realistic improvement would be a 16 team league so teams only playing each other twice. 20 is unfeasable as there would be no one left in the lower leagues capable of the step up. the league cup would have to be revamped, perhaps into a sort of champions league format, so as to make up the missing revenue from losing 7 league games. Quote
Ajja Posted February 23, 2009 Report Posted February 23, 2009 The problem is that while increasing the 'risk' of relegation by having two up two down and play off type ideas in place seems to be the way to force teams to jazz up their football its exactly the thing that brings the stale and mundane football to the fore. With finances the way they are, teams are increasingly playing 'safety snooker' football to ensure they don't get caught at the trap door. Surely a bigger league set up removes familiarity as teams play each other less and brings a sense of security that means teams can invest and theoretically play a better brand of football safe in the knowledge that relegation into the wildernesses of Scottish football is less of a risk ?? Quote
glasgow sheep Posted February 23, 2009 Author Report Posted February 23, 2009 The problem is that while increasing the 'risk' of relegation by having two up two down and play off type ideas in place seems to be the way to force teams to jazz up their football its exactly the thing that brings the stale and mundane football to the fore. With finances the way they are, teams are increasingly playing 'safety snooker' football to ensure they don't get caught at the trap door. Surely a bigger league set up removes familiarity as teams play each other less and brings a sense of security that means teams can invest and theoretically play a better brand of football safe in the knowledge that relegation into the wildernesses of Scottish football is less of a risk ?? Bigger league will never happen. There aren't enough clubs of a sufficient size to have a 18 or 20 team league. A 16 team league means 4 LESS home games, ontop of this instead of home games vs rangers, celtic, hearts, united and hibs we get home games vs st johnstone, livvie, thistle and dundee. TV revenue would be less also given both the drop in number of games and drop in quantity of marketable games. Apart from the OF the league as it stands has worked pretty well in recent years (if you ignore the aberration that was Gretna). Take this season: 3 way battle for 3rd/europe, then possibly a 3 way fight for "top 6" and then a right old scrap to avoid relegation. Expand the league and half the clubs will have nothing to play for by now. Quote
Mackie's ace! Posted February 23, 2009 Report Posted February 23, 2009 Celtic's latest idea - entering a 'B' team into the third division... Quote
BrownyBrown Posted February 23, 2009 Report Posted February 23, 2009 http://www.thedandies.co.uk/messageboard/index.php?topic=7783.0 Its a fucking shite state of affairs though... Quote
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