glasgowdon Posted June 1, 2011 Report Posted June 1, 2011 Why don't "the powers that be" just admit what they really want....a top league of however many teams you like, with a top 2 split right at the start so the bigots can play each other 30 times! Give yourself a break. All my mates were bored of Old Firm games by the end of last season. Quote
jmo Posted June 1, 2011 Report Posted June 1, 2011 Both the 10 team proposal and the 14 team proposal seem worse than the current set up imo. It seems unlikely they will decide on more than 14 teams so personally, whilst the split, one up and one down relegation and only having 12 teams isn't ideal it seems better than any of the likely alternatives. Seems like change for changes sake. Quote
dave_min Posted June 1, 2011 Report Posted June 1, 2011 Give yourself a break. All my mates were bored of Old Firm games by the end of last season. Quote
Madbadteacher Posted June 1, 2011 Report Posted June 1, 2011 Give yourself a break. All my mates were bored of Old Firm games by the end of last season. [/quote.] I'm guessing you think "irony" is like "tinny" only a different metal? Quote
dave_min Posted June 1, 2011 Report Posted June 1, 2011 All my mates were bored of Old Firm games by the start of last season. <insert unemployed emo-goth smiley here> Quote
topcorner Posted June 15, 2011 Report Posted June 15, 2011 Was reading Jim Spence's blog today about the subject... http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/jimspence/2011/06/is_it_time_up_for_the_scottish.html Very average blog, but some of the opinions posted afterwards are quite interesting... The top 24 teams in the country at the end of next season form two leagues, SPL 1 and 2 with 12 teams in each; each team plays each other home and away = 22 games; at this point the 2 leagues split into 3 sections of 8, who then play each other home and away again = a further 14 games = 36 games in total. This means the top 8 retain the 4 old firm/Edinburgh derby games to satisfy the TV companies. The middle 8 are effectively playing off for qualification into the top 12 for the following season, as follows: the bottom team in SPL 1 and the top team in SPL 2 would start this playoff section level on points, teams 9-11 in SPL 1 would have a +ve handicap based on the number of points ahead of the bottom team they were at the end of the 22 games, and teams 2-4 in SPL 2 would start on -ve points based on how far behind the top team they were. The top 4 at the end of the 14 game section qualify for SPL 1 for the next season. The bottom 8 would play off against one another to determine their final positions, with the bottom 2/3 going in to relegation playoffs with the top teams from the regional pyramid below, which contains the remaining SFL clubs who didn't make the top 2 leagues plus those junior/east of Scotland/highland teams who join the pyramid. This system would have the advantage of providing attractive fixtures all the way down the pyramid, as more teams would have more to play for towards the end of the season. I would suggest running the season from March to October to provide better conditions for players and fans alike and I would experiment with games on, for example, Friday evenings, particularly for clubs lower down the pyramid, as they may just find that if they adjust the entry prices accordingly they manage to attract some old firm fans in their local areas who would normally be at Ibrox or Parkhead - particularly if these games are being played in mild spring/summer/early autumn temperatures as opposed to the middle of the winter. All things being equal, more attractive fixtures should lead to more fans, more sponsors and more TV revenues. Regional leagues below the SPL 2 would mean reduced traveling costs for the small clubs and their supporters, and would provide more local derbies, which should again bring higher crowds, particularly in context of a spring-autumn season That's one of the better ideas i've heard Quote
Edinburghdon Posted June 15, 2011 Report Posted June 15, 2011 What the fuck is wrong with just normal simple football? Fuck all this handicap pish, a level financial playing field, competitive teams and play offs for the relegation/promotion spots is whats needed. It's not going to improve over night but I'd much rather things started from scratch than all this stupid gimmicks. Quote
topcorner Posted June 15, 2011 Report Posted June 15, 2011 What the fuck is wrong with just normal simple football? Because in Scotland, it's fuckin pish! All the handicap stuff is a bit too much, but something more than 1 playoff spot or 2 extra teams needs to be done. Last season, for the last few months of the season, only 2 teams could win the league, only 2 teams could get Europe, and only 2 teams could get relegated. That's just shite and half the reason no fucker is gonna give us a tv deal. Quote
BobbyBiscuit Posted June 15, 2011 Author Report Posted June 15, 2011 What the fuck is wrong with just normal simple football? Fuck all this handicap pish, a level financial playing field, competitive teams and play offs for the relegation/promotion spots is whats needed. It's not going to improve over night but I'd much rather things started from scratch than all this stupid gimmicks. Agreed. But the problem with having the split is that the powers that be seem to think they now have to have a gimmick, that it's the only way forward. Quote
Madbadteacher Posted June 15, 2011 Report Posted June 15, 2011 Shit, why not have the teams below a certain number of points have 12 players to give them a chance to be competitive? Or play with a fucking beach ball? Or each team has to have a blonde bint wi big titties? :hammer: :hammer: It's football, it's a league, play each other team home and away (make the league big enough for that to last a season? Maybe have a couple of knockout cup competitions? Or is that just too fucking radical? Quote
topcorner Posted June 15, 2011 Report Posted June 15, 2011 It's football, it's a league, play each other team home and away (make the league big enough for that to last a season? Maybe have a couple of knockout cup competitions? Or is that just too fucking radical? Is that not what we have just now? Where everyone is bored of the same old shit with attendances dropping everywhere? Quote
Edinburghdon Posted June 15, 2011 Report Posted June 15, 2011 Or each team has to have a blonde bint wi big titties? its only taken you 3491 attempts but you've finally managed to post something even remotely worthwhile, well done! Agreed. But the problem with having the split is that the powers that be seem to think they now have to have a gimmick, that it's the only way forward. I honestly believe the only thing that will fix our game is properly competitive football, that's what the authorities should be concentrating on, not stupid fucking gimmicks. Quote
Madbadteacher Posted June 15, 2011 Report Posted June 15, 2011 its only taken you 3491 attempts but you've finally managed to post something even remotely worthwhile, well done! No. I managed another worthwhile post once before! I honestly believe the only thing that will fix our game is properly competitive football, that's what the authorities should be concentrating on, not stupid fucking gimmicks. THIS Quote
Kowalski Posted June 15, 2011 Report Posted June 15, 2011 Was reading Jim Spence's blog today about the subject... http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/jimspence/2011/06/is_it_time_up_for_the_scottish.html Very average blog, but some of the opinions posted afterwards are quite interesting... That's one of the better ideas i've heard What a load of fucking shite that sounds. Quote
bloo_toon_red Posted June 15, 2011 Report Posted June 15, 2011 The more I've thought about it as time has worn on, the more I am in favour of the ten team SPL with a ten team second tier and regional leagues below that. There are only around 20 full-time teams here. Whilst a 16-team league seems less repetitive for players and fans, it isn't sustainable to play only 30 league games in a season at a time when we can't attract, nor keep, good players here. A comment was made earlier in this thread about there being a dearth of young talent. I don't actually think that there is. The problem is simply that young players can have one good season in the SPL and be lured by the big bucks on offer in the lower English leagues. They don't allow themselves to be nurtured into mature, consistent performers. The reality in the majority of cases is that so many of these players don't possess the necessary experience to adapt down south - how many players have become "homesick" or plain disappeared? The parachute payment system down south has now come to bear fruit insofar as there are now a number of teams in the Championship with real financial muscle, spreading the wealth about with big transfer fees. A fixture list in a 16 team SPL would always throw up at least 2 fixtures every week of the calibre of Hamilton v St Johnstone, Falkirk v St Mirren, with sub-4k attendances. And each season, there is a clear and present danger of a Cowdenbeath, a Brechin or a Stranraer gaining promotion to the top league. It's romantic, yes, but is this what we want to showcase to the world? Do we want 5k in Pittodrie to watch Aberdeen v Cowdenbeath, and another similar crowd a fortnight later when Hamilton come calling? A ten team SPL pits the best against the best most weeks, there will be better quality, there will be more interest in games and in turn generate more cashflow. More cashflow, a bit more razzmatazz and glamour, players gain confidence from playing in a competitive league, attractive to sponsors and who knows what could be possible. Radically alter the league cup. Call it the "SPL Invitational". Invite teams from Holland, Belgium and Scandinavia to take part; have either a group stage set-up or play over two legs - the 20 SPL teams and 12 foreign. Giving Scottish players experience of playing against foreign opposition in a competitive environment, preparing them for the future rigours of European or International competition. Might help our national coaches to take notice of promising young players before they get their moves to Rangers, Celtic or Derby County! Maybe even spring a few surprises. All about the money? Perhaps. But just look where our young talent are looking towards, and then try and convince me that 20% less games, half of them meaningless and uncompetitive, in a 30-game season in front of small crowds will improve things. Quote
Kowalski Posted September 23, 2011 Report Posted September 23, 2011 As much as it pains me to say it, I agree with some of Pressley's comments: http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/football/spl/2011/09/23/cup-results-have-shown-two-leagues-of-20-is-the-way-to-go-says-steven-pressley-and-brian-reid-86908-23439966/ Steven Pressley: "People have been talking about a 16-team league and last year I'd have gone along with that because at our club we just needed a change - any change. "But now I look at it and the more I see, the more I'm convinced we need something more radical in the shape of a 20-team league. "Yes, there must be criteria for any club in the top flight. They need their own permanent training facilities even if they are not state of the art. And all clubs must also have their own academies. If you've got those things in place then that should be enough. "It's not about everyone having 10,000 all-seater stadiums that no one can fill. It's about getting the football right and making sure the fans come back. "We've become obsessed with chasing TV money to the point our clubs are now reliant upon it. But that is entirely the wrong way round and we must reverse the cycle. "Our clubs should be less reliant on TV money and more focused on getting the punters back through the doors. It's not rocket science. "There is a monotony about Scottish football and it is killing the game. You just need to look at all the empty seats. "Tell me this, how long do you think it's going to be before the TV firms turn round and say: Your stadiums are empty - we can't keep showing this. "Are we going to wait until they refuse to pay or will we act now to turn it round and give the fans a product we can be proud of." Brian Reid: "We need a bigger top flight and I'd go for a 20-team set-up. "Listen, I like cream crackers. But if I ate them every day for a month I'd soon be sick of them. "On the other hand, if I went a month without them and then ate just one I'd probably think it was the best cream cracker I'd ever tasted. "When I played in England with Blackpool and Burnley I found the whole thing so refreshing because we were playing different teams at different grounds every week. "You'd be excited about a long trip down south to a place like Plymouth because it was new and you only got to go there once a year. "It's a simple concept and I don't understand why people here don't get it. The supporters are fed up watching their sides play the same teams five or six times a season. "It's the same old story and that's why crowds are dropping. "The prices have stayed high, the economy is struggling and the fans are being asked to dig deep for the same old stuff they've seen a hundred times before. It's stale." Pressley: "A 20-team league would create all kinds of interesting local derbies spread throughout the season. And how much more exciting would Old Firm derbies be if there were only two a season? "I watched the fourth Edinburgh derby of last season and there was hardly anyone there! "I've never seen Easter Road so empty for a match like that. "So we have to find a way to excite the supporters and I'm convinced 20 teams is the way ahead. "The top three would qualify for Europe. The fourth, fifth, sixth and seventh-placed teams would go into play-offs for the final European spot. "You could have 11 or 12 teams all fighting for those places all the way to the end of the season. "At the foot of the table two teams would go down and the side third from bottom would go into a play-off. "That could involve five or six teams all battling it out. Most teams in the league would therefore have something to play for. "Managers would also have the chance to do what we're trying to achieve at Falkirk in terms of bringing our own players through. "I couldn't do that in a 10 or 12-team SPL. It simply doesn't allow for it." Reid: "I realise the TV deals are all about getting four Old Firm games a season but when are we going to realise Scottish football is not just about Rangers and Celtic? "We have to do what is best for the game in general. "The evidence is there when you look at results like our win over Hearts and Falkirk knocking Rangers out on the same night. "I'm not saying a club like Ayr could beat these teams week in week out but the top six or seven clubs in the First Division are full-time and there is not a big difference in the standard between them and most of the SPL. "What we should all be aiming for is to improve those standards and, for me, having a bigger league would help managers do that and bring through their own young players. "If our result against Hearts or Falkirk's win over Rangers makes people sit up and take stock and debate the idea of two leagues of 20 then between us we might have done the game in this country a right good turn." Quote
tlg1903 Posted September 23, 2011 Report Posted September 23, 2011 In all that blurb kow there wasn't one sentence i disagreed with, quite surprising for such large quotes. No doubt pressley has a reputation for being a bit of a cunt but if you take club rivalrys off the agenda he was really just a solid bastard of a centre half who wanted to win. I remember when he was 31/32ish there was rumours we may be trying to sign him and the hat (the forum i used at the time.......... i 'm not proud of it, i just hadnt heard of donstalk by this point) went into meltdown. For me i would have had him in a second, we lacked a leader big time when anderson left and he would have done very nicely. Bet we wouldnt have shipped four to QoS if he had been in our squad. I try not to hold that dislike against some players (note some) when they quit the game. Cunt or not theres no doubt he has decent footballing intellect and i had a lot of respect for him when he stood up to mad vlad. By all accounts falkirk are starting to come good after a tough first 18 months and playing some nice stuff with a young squad. I certainly wouldnt write off the possibility of pressley becoming a good manager so im not particularly surprised to hear talking an awful lot of sense. His voice grates to fuck though, sounds like a gorrilla trying to purr like a cat Quote
manc_don Posted September 23, 2011 Report Posted September 23, 2011 I can't disagree with either of those points. It's quite refreshing to read actually, especially the last blurb by Reid! Quote
tom_widdows Posted December 20, 2011 Report Posted December 20, 2011 http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/scotland/16278305.stm Scotland's 42 senior clubs have been asked to consider proposals on league reconstruction. A paper produced at the request of the Scottish Football Association's professional game board recommends a streamlining to one governing body. It also suggests an extra promotion and relegation place between the Scottish Premier League and the First Division, via a system of play-offs. A pyramid structure would open up entry to the bottom tier of the game. Club chairmen will study the paper and send feedback to the SFA for consideration in late January. The proposals also include enhanced parachute payments for clubs relegated from the SPL and a new method of distributing money aimed, in particular, at bridging the gap between the bottom of the top flight and the top of the Scottish Football League. Scotland's league and cup competitions are currently overseen by the SFA, SPL and SFL. The paper suggests one corporate body be set up to govern the leagues by the summer of next year, with the 12 SPL clubs and 30 SFL clubs under its umbrella. It recommends changes to the leagues' voting systems and a seven-man main board to administer the new set-up, supported by an operational board of a similar size. The listed model for the distribution of revenue, sees SPL clubs taking 90% of the first £19m raised, with 5% going to the next tier - possibly renamed the Scottish Championship. Of the next £4m raised, 70% would go to the top flight, with the league immediately below taking 25%. SPL clubs would get their hands on 85% of any distributable revenue above £23m. Under the proposals for SPL play-offs, the bottom side would be automatically relegated and replaced by the winners of the league below, with the club finishing 11th involved in two-legged ties with those in second, third and fourth in the second tier. The play-offs for the remaining divisions would follow the same model. To cushion the blow of relegation from the SPL, it is suggested that parachute payments be increased from £250,000 to £400,000 in the first season and from £125,000 to £200,000 in the case of a team staying down for a second term. On the subject of a pyramid structure, the idea of forming super-leagues for the Highlands and Lowlands from 2013/14 is put forward. The winners of each division would meet over two legs, with the victor then facing the bottom side in the senior set-up. There would also be access to the new Lowland and Highland leagues from feeder divisions, again via play-offs. Quote
glasgow sheep Posted December 20, 2011 Report Posted December 20, 2011 http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/scotland/16278305.stm Essentially the McLeish report with figures. They can fuck off with a second tier "Scottish Championship" however Quote
tlg1903 Posted December 20, 2011 Report Posted December 20, 2011 i'm pleased to see that top of the agenda is getting rid of 3 governing bodies Quote
Jute Posted December 21, 2011 Report Posted December 21, 2011 I see our chairman is in the papers again this morning claiming that a 10 team SPL is the only way to save Scottish football. Quote
glasgow sheep Posted December 21, 2011 Report Posted December 21, 2011 I see our chairman is in the papers again this morning claiming that a 10 team SPL is the only way to save Scottish football. It's great they have come up with a revolutionary idea isn't it? Although the proposals of a pyramid, play offs and single administrative body are all excellent, if long over due Quote
mizer Posted December 21, 2011 Report Posted December 21, 2011 I see our chairman is in the papers again this morning claiming that a 10 team SPL is the only way to save Scottish football. Or as it should be called the clique option. Quote
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