Union Terrace Gardens Vote

[TENEMENTFUNSTER]

 

Westburn Park:

 

Nice weather: Park busy.

Poor weather: Park quiet.

Middle of the night: Park has jakeys.

 

UTG:

 

Nice weather: Park busy.

Poor weather: Park quiet.

Middle of the night: Park has jakeys.

 

 

Better build something on Westburn Park too!

 

 

Perhaps it was, TF. But £140m (and the rest) seems an affa lot of money just so it could be used at all times.

 

I agree completely but nothing seems to be what a vocal minority want done. It's a fucking time warp, nothing new, just tart up the auld stuff, that'll do.

[Tyrant]

It certainly appears to be that Aberdeen is closed for business. But it has to make sense. And to me Ian Wood's UTG vision has never made sense. It would have made a lot more sense to me if he was footing the whole bill, like.

[dave_min]

Better build something on Westburn Park too!

 

But then where will all the gays go for their nightly fix of sex with strangers?

 

You've not thought this one through you hetro.

[Kowalski]

 

Westburn Park:

 

Nice weather: Park busy.

Poor weather: Park quiet.

Middle of the night: Park has jakeys.

 

UTG:

 

Nice weather: Park busy.

Poor weather: Park quiet.

Middle of the night: Park has jakeys.

 

 

Better build something on Westburn Park too!

 

 

Perhaps it was, TF. But £140m (and the rest) seems an affa lot of money just so it could be used at all times.

 

But Westburn Park is easily accessible.  It probably has loads more people in it on a sunny day than UTG ever has.  I walk past UTG every day, it's deserted.  I'm all for opening up access from Belmont Street but wasn't particularly fond of the Granite Web design, but voted for it as I thought I was voting for taking it to the next stage - not getting it built yet.

[Superstar Tradesman]

 

Westburn Park:

 

Nice weather: Park busy.

Poor weather: Park quiet.

Middle of the night: Park has jakeys.

 

UTG:

 

Nice weather: Park busy.

Poor weather: Park quiet.

Middle of the night: Park has jakeys.

 

 

Better build something on Westburn Park too!

 

You're confusing UTG with a park.

 

It's not.

 

It's a massive hole in the ground with some trees and shit.

 

Mostly shit.

 

 

[Tyrant]

But it is a park. And it might be shit but a lot of Aberdeen is shit but we're not spunking millions on it making it (arguably) less shit.

[Dandy_Don]

But it is a park. And it might be shit but a lot of Aberdeen is shit but we're not spunking millions on it making it (arguably) less shit.

 

Great then. Let's leave it all like it is. Maybe we can become a Scottish Beamish?

[Tyrant]

Great then. Let's leave it all like it is. Maybe we can become a Scottish Beamish?

 

 

I ken you're casting the line and seeing what happens because I think you ken full well that's nae what I'm saying. The cooncil is skint. The whole country is. Most of the world is. Surely money needs to be spent on more important things until better times when money can be spared on making nice but not necessarily necessary superficial improvements to parks?

[Superstar Tradesman]

I ken you're casting the line and seeing what happens because I think you ken full well that's nae what I'm saying. The cooncil is skint. The whole country is. Most of the world is. Surely money needs to be spent on more important things until better times when money can be spared on making nice but not necessarily necessary superficial improvements to parks?

 

Jesus H. Christ.

 

Here we go again.

 

OK, one more time for the special people........

 

The money isn't sitting in a bank somewhere earmarked to sort out pot holes, the NHS, Pittodrie, schools, cracked paving slabs, Union St, rehab centres, bendy buses, sheltered housing or anything else the Council have neglected over the past few decades.  It's been offered up for redevelopment of UTG and NOTHING ELSE.

 

The world is skint.

 

The country is bollocksed.

 

The council are in debt.

 

Folk are brassed.

 

Wood and his stooges are minted and offering magic beans.

 

"Nah, yer a'richt min".

 

 

 

[Kowalski]

The money isn't sitting in a bank somewhere earmarked to sort out pot holes, the NHS, Pittodrie, schools, cracked paving slabs, Union St, rehab centres, bendy buses, sheltered housing or anything else the Council have neglected over the past few decades.  It's been offered up for redevelopment of UTG and NOTHING ELSE.

 

For some reason, many people have struggled to grasp the above.

[Tyrant]

 

Jesus H. Christ.

 

Here we go again.

 

OK, one more time for the special people........

 

The money isn't sitting in a bank somewhere earmarked to sort out pot holes, the NHS, Pittodrie, schools, cracked paving slabs, Union St, rehab centres, bendy buses, sheltered housing or anything else the Council have neglected over the past few decades.  It's been offered up for redevelopment of UTG and NOTHING ELSE.

 

The world is skint.

 

The country is bollocksed.

 

The council are in debt.

 

Folk are brassed.

 

Wood and his stooges are minted and offering magic beans.

 

"Nah, yer a'richt min".

 

 

 

 

 

Have you even bothered reading my posts min? For Fuck FFS sake here we go again! One more time for those with selective hearing.

 

Cost of project: £140m (and the rest)

Money being offered by Mannie Wood: £50m plus up to £35m if it goes over budget (and it will.)

 

I'm no Asian but I still think I'm getting my maths correct here:

 

£140m

-£50m

=£90m

 

NINETY FUCKING MILLION. Who's "offering this up"? The cooncil has to find it from somewhere.

 

What I've struggled to grasp, Kow, is why people seem to think the whole lot is being paid for privately when it just fucking isn't. (not saying you specifically think this, like.) And unless 100% of the cost comes from private investment (LOL) it's going to be taking funding away from other much more worthwhile causes. It's not happening because we can't afford it. The funding isn't there. If the whole project was being covered it'd be half finished by now.

[Kowalski]

The £90M was coming from the Scottish Government by way of a TIF which is a loan repaid directly from business rates.  There was certainly some risk involved in that but it wasn't £90M coming out of the council's budget, and certainly wasn't being taken from any other worthwhile causes.

[Tyrant]

The loan repayments have to be paid by ACC. So over time the £90m (plus interest albeit it a lower rate?) comes out of the council's budget. Or have I missed something?

[Superstar Tradesman]

So £90m to be repaid by a shiny new bit of turf turning over money compared to a hole in the grun costing money to keep whilst nobody uses it.

 

Actually, add another million to the cost of the upkeep whilst you're at it:

 

http://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/Article.aspx/2913050

 

Maybe the council should just close Union Terrace to cars and better utilise the £1m they don't have to not close a school that doesn't exist?

[Tyrant]

But how long is it going to take to regenerate the £90m?

 

I'm all for fucking building something but this is simply not fucking financially viable!!!!11!!1!

[Superstar Tradesman]

But how long is it going to take to regenerate the £90m?

 

I'm all for fucking building something but this is simply not fucking financially viable!!!!11!!1!

 

Seriously, who gives a shit how long it takes to pay off?

 

How long did it take them to pay off their £80m new headquarters?

 

The council are just scared they'll actually have to knuckle down and do some work for a change, instead of relying on easy money from parking fines, permits, council tax and government handouts.

[tom_widdows]

 

Seriously, who gives a shit how long it takes to pay off?

 

 

I think the locals will when their bin collections are cut back to monthly, Few more schools get amalgamated but at the same time cutting the level of teachers to deal with the larger classes, Duthie Park and the like lose a few parkies and start becoming overgrown, etc etc.

 

The 90million loan based on being paid off by business rates is a very scary thought (for me anyway) as it smacks of the thinking that fucked the world economey.

Yes sir heres a 110% mortgage. Dont worry in 5 years time yer house will be worth 1.5times what it is now.

Madam why not release some equity in yer home. Then you can get yerself a new car or go on a luxury holiday. Dont worry about repaying it as property values are going up and up you know.

why of course mr council man, 90million will easily be repaid in a booming city like Aberdeen. I mean just look at Union Street, you cant get a unit/ office in there for love nor money 

 

Be even more entertaining when they started digging out the land and found things no one knew about - Ancient relics, old foundations, old gas mains or sewers long forgotten about, underground streams, large build up of bedrock that will need blasting. Then of course the inevitable contractor disputes, potential for adverse weather conditions and the whole mess with Scotrail as to how you work safetly over their line without restricting their services. 140million suddenly becomes 150million and the steadily rises till the QS says 'woaaah there, we need to find savings somewhere.....get rid of that bit...and that...and that...can we change that etc.

[Tyrant]

I think the locals will when their bin collections are cut back to monthly, Few more schools get amalgamated but at the same time cutting the level of teachers to deal with the larger classes, Duthie Park and the like lose a few parkies and start becoming overgrown, etc etc.

 

The 90million loan based on being paid off by business rates is a very scary thought (for me anyway) as it smacks of the thinking that fucked the world economey.

Yes sir heres a 110% mortgage. Dont worry in 5 years time yer house will be worth 1.5times what it is now.

Madam why not release some equity in yer home. Then you can get yerself a new car or go on a luxury holiday. Dont worry about repaying it as property values are going up and up you know.

why of course mr council man, 90million will easily be repaid in a booming city like Aberdeen. I mean just look at Union Street, you cant get a unit/ office in there for love nor money 

 

Be even more entertaining when they started digging out the land and found things no one knew about - Ancient relics, old foundations, old gas mains or sewers long forgotten about, underground streams, large build up of bedrock that will need blasting. Then of course the inevitable contractor disputes, potential for adverse weather conditions and the whole mess with Scotrail as to how you work safetly over their line without restricting their services. 140million suddenly becomes 150million and the steadily rises till the QS says 'woaaah there, we need to find savings somewhere.....get rid of that bit...and that...and that...can we change that etc.

 

 

Take yer sensible and rational thoughts away from this UTG debate, Tom!

[maverick sheep]

the world is skint because muppets were smooth-talked into taking out humungous loans they couldn't pay back. aberdeen would be off it's chump to take out any unnecessary loan.

 

as tam says, the repayments can only come from cut backs in council services, and in this scheme that would go on for many a year. and that is on top of the cuts that are happening and going to continue to happen even without the scheme happening.

 

aberdeen have so far dodged a bullet.

[Kowalski]

Protest against Aberdeen City Garden Project vote

 

A protest against Aberdeen City Council's decision to reject the £140m City Garden Project is being planned.

Councillors voted to scrap the plan to transform the historic Union Terrace Gardens last week.

A protest is due to take place outside the city council's headquarters, Marischal College, on Saturday 22 September at 13:00.

Organisers have started a campaign on a social networking site to raise support for the protest.

Labour - senior partners on the ruling coalition - earlier said it was exploring using other sources of money to fund city centre improvements.

[Tyrant]

the world is skint because muppets were smooth-talked into taking out humungous loans they couldn't pay back. aberdeen would be off it's chump to take out any unnecessary loan.

 

as tam says, the repayments can only come from cut backs in council services, and in this scheme that would go on for many a year. and that is on top of the cuts that are happening and going to continue to happen even without the scheme happening.

 

aberdeen have so far dodged a bullet.

 

 

[Kowalski]

 

 

The repayments come from business rates, not from any cut backs in council services.

 

It's clear that many who are against the proposal have not understood how it was supposed to be funded.

[dave_min]

The repayments come from business rates, not from any cut backs in council services.

 

It's clear that many who are against the proposal have not understood how it was supposed to be funded.

 

The theory is easy enough to understand, it's just people have some pretty serious reservations as it's a scheme thats never successfully worked before.

[Tyrant]

The theory is easy enough to understand, it's just people have some pretty serious reservations as it's a scheme thats never successfully worked before.

 

Precisely. I know how it's funded in theory but as far as I can see it's 99% likely to end up being a giant waste of money. If it was something we needed like a hospital or titty bar then I'd be more inclined to support such a risk.

[Kowalski]

Precisely. I know how it's funded in theory but as far as I can see it's 99% likely to end up being a giant waste of money. If it was something we needed like a hospital or titty bar then I'd be more inclined to support such a risk.

 

Why do we need a hospital?