Crazy American Politics

[Madbadteacher]

The police are NOT being prevented from doing their job. I see police doing their job all the time. That's just sensationalism.

The US still thinks it's the "best country in the world", I see little evidence to the contrary. where else is "World News" what happened outside of your TV viewing area but still the US? Trump and his supporters still think they can tell the rest of the US and the World what to do and how to think.

Neither Trump or Biden is a good choice, but unlike Trump Biden is an experienced politician who is likely to listen to opinions and advice and not run head first like a bull in a china shop. Government needs to be able to govern and, if you're constantly reacting to/trying to repair things your Commander in Chief has said or done that's difficult. Both parties are divisive, but under Trump the Republicans are actively creating more disharmony in the US than any outside agency. The man has already intimated he's not going to accept losing the election which should clearly render him unsuitable for that (or any) office.

My apologies for the unnecessary insults previously. 

 

[Elgindon]

14 minutes ago, Madbadteacher said:

The police are NOT being prevented from doing their job. I see police doing their job all the time. That's just sensationalism.

The US still thinks it's the "best country in the world", I see little evidence to the contrary. where else is "World News" what happened outside of your TV viewing area but still the US? Trump and his supporters still think they can tell the rest of the US and the World what to do and how to think.

Neither Trump or Biden is a good choice, but unlike Trump Biden is an experienced politician who is likely to listen to opinions and advice and not run head first like a bull in a china shop. Government needs to be able to govern and, if you're constantly reacting to/trying to repair things your Commander in Chief has said or done that's difficult. Both parties are divisive, but under Trump the Republicans are actively creating more disharmony in the US than any outside agency. The man has already intimated he's not going to accept losing the election which should clearly render him unsuitable for that (or any) office.

My apologies for the unnecessary insults previously. 

 

Maybe 'afraid to do their job' is a better way to put it,because of the actions of a handful,but being portrayed as a group as the bad guys.

  The economy pre Covid,appeared to be growing from the bottom up,and as a result Blacks and Hispanics('helping minorities'), job opportunities and wages were rising faster than other groups?

 https://www.officer.com/on-the-street/video/12079659/are-officers-afraid-to-do-their-jobs

[Dandy_Don]

23 hours ago, wee toon red said:

If it’s the democratic governors to blame for the riots, how come it’s only happened since trump got into power?

Alas this is the problem. It isn't just happening since Trump got elected, but it sure as hell is getting the media coverage.

Under Obama - just from memory - there was rioting in Ferguson, Oakland (Michael Brown), Baltimore (Freddie Gray) and Charlotte (Lamont Scott). I'm sure there were more but my memory fails me. 

In many of these cases the initial narrative is "Bad police shoot unarmed black man". Then it's discovered that there's more to it, such as Michael Brown trying to wrestle the gun from the cop. Or in the more recent case of Jacob Blake (accused of rape) went for a knife AFTER having been tased. Excuse the unfortunate pun but it's rarely black and white and the media love whipping people into a frenzy and for a long time the Democrats actively encouraged the riots because it was helping them in the polls. However, since recent polling has shown people have started to change their views (e.g. LA-Don has given you his reasons in this thread - it has gone from peaceful protesting for a just cause to wanton thuggery and violence) they've started walking that back. They have the power to end the rioting if they so choose but until the last couple of days the Democratic Mayors and Governors have fanned the flames in order to push their narrative.

[Dandy_Don]

21 hours ago, Madbadteacher said:

LA I live in the US

No! He has not (unless locking them up is "more")?

He isn't

Again, no!

Good God man, you're an idiot!

BTW I'm not a looney leftie even in the UK, I'm probably quite right of center in UK politics in my views (although I'm not a Tory), but you're colouring things here, to appeal to whatever audience you choose, that don't actually live here.

You probably think "Defund the police" means let's have criminality run riot" or "not pay a police force" rather than the truth that it means: stop funding police in schools, hospitals, other places they're not needed and let those organisations spend THAT funding on something they NEED. Before you ask, I taught in schools that couldn't afford books, or enough teachers, or even enough bathrooms, because the police "funding" was like $500,000 per week. Putting that $500,000 a week back in schools is "defunding the police".  It's the same situation elsewhere, the police aren't "funded" by the government but the "cost" is take out of the budget of where they're deposited.

 

Those of you in Scotland want an equivalent? It's like charging the school 10 million quid a year for having a  meeting no-one wants, cares about or attends! 

 

"unless locking them up is 'more'?"

In 2018, Trump signed the First Step Act, a criminal justice bill which enacted reforms that make the justice system fairer and help former inmates successfully return to society.

The First Step Act’s reforms addressed inequities in sentencing laws that disproportionately harmed Black Americans and reformed mandatory minimums that created unfair outcomes.

The First Step Act expanded judicial discretion in sentencing of non-violent crimes.

Over 90% of those benefiting from the retroactive sentencing reductions in the First Step Act are Black Americans.

The First Step Act provides rehabilitative programs to inmates, helping them successfully rejoin society and not return to crime.

Trump increased funding for historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCUs) by more than 14%.

Trump signed legislation forgiving Hurricane Katrina debt that threatened HBCUs.

New single-family home sales are up 31.6% in October 2019 compared to just the previous year.

Made HBCUs a priority by creating the position of executive director of the White House Initiative on HBCUs.

Trump received the Bipartisan Justice Award at a historically black college for his criminal justice reform accomplishments.

The poverty rate fell to a 17-year low of 11.8% under the Trump administration as a result of a jobs-rich environment.

Poverty rates for African-Americans and Hispanic-Americans have reached their lowest levels since the U.S. began collecting such data.

 

Now don't get me wrong, is he a complete buffoon at times? ABSOLUTELY. However, suggesting that his only achievement is "locking them up" is quite clearly ridiculous.

[LA-Don]

Got sent this today. Curious for feedback. I think it's valid that the guy says you can clearly dislike Trump yet still vote republican. Social justice totally dominates my job right now and I dare not speak up.

 

 

[LA-Don]

The debate last night. Oh boy. What a shit show!

[Madbadteacher]

It was awful. I had to turn it off. I went and read instead.

Fucking primary school playground stuff!

 

I don't know why they bother, something like less than 10% of the voters are "undecided" allegedly, and I doubt many of them are going to make a decision based on a TV special

[RicoS321]

It was tragic. Is this the best democracy has to offer? There needs to be a massive systemic change both sides of the Atlantic. That isn't a choice. The US and the world can do much better than this, time for a long hard look at it.

[LA-Don]

23 minutes ago, RicoS321 said:

It was tragic. Is this the best democracy has to offer? There needs to be a massive systemic change both sides of the Atlantic. That isn't a choice. The US and the world can do much better than this, time for a long hard look at it.

It's awful. So embarrassing too. I'm so upset that the democrats had four years to come up with a plan and a candidate to win an election and this is the best they could do. Two bickering old men. It also says a lot about the country in general and where it is as a culture that Donald Trump could be president for 8 years. Regardless of policies, a president should be someone you are proud to represent a country (hopefully), this is the opposite.

[RicoS321]

3 hours ago, LA-Don said:

It's awful. So embarrassing too. I'm so upset that the democrats had four years to come up with a plan and a candidate to win an election and this is the best they could do. Two bickering old men. It also says a lot about the country in general and where it is as a culture that Donald Trump could be president for 8 years. Regardless of policies, a president should be someone you are proud to represent a country (hopefully), this is the opposite.

But it's far more systemic than that. Even if the democrats had put up a more credible candidate, it would have made no difference. The childish football match of left vs right, Dems Vs republicans, good Vs evil or whatever the bullshit representation is has to go. It's not democracy, it's a charade. Political systems should be regularly changed and improved. Especially when the future potential of the human race is at stake. We can just do better. Why does a political or economic system have to be so sacrosanct that it can't improve over time? Look at all the pompous archaic shite we still do in the UK in the Westminster crèche. Time for a revolution. And nae from some cunts who think wearing a mask is curtailing their freedom.

[LA-Don]

Of course it is, this place is wacko right now. Trump is in power because of the nations disgust with and protest of the whole political system, but clearly this place has gotten worse. I just think had the democrats found some younger and inspirational visionary who could motivate and promote unity we may have been onto something. But it’s two polar opposite parties led by bickering old men, plus the democrats have gone more left on policy and that has definitely scared those who are pretty much in the middle (like me.....I think!) Don’t see the election making a difference regardless of who wins, this place is fucked up for a good while longer.

Edited October 2, 2020 by LA-Don

[manc_don]

What do you think about Harris , LA?

[LA-Don]

21 hours ago, manc_don said:

What do you think about Harris , LA?

Honestly no clue. It’s the democrats policies that scare me, not the individuals. She’s debating pence this week so that may give more insight but the cynic in me thinks she’s on the ticket because she’s a woman and person of color. 

[RicoS321]

10 hours ago, LA-Don said:

Honestly no clue. It’s the democrats policies that scare me, not the individuals. She’s debating pence this week so that may give more insight but the cynic in me thinks she’s on the ticket because she’s a woman and person of color. 

Which particular policies? Seems fairly normal, centre right, stuff. Maybe a few tokens thrown in for the left. Surely you don't see Biden as someone who's going to stray too far from the donor class' wishes? He's just a slightly shitter Obama.

[LA-Don]

On 04/10/2020 at 01:37, RicoS321 said:

Which particular policies? Seems fairly normal, centre right, stuff. Maybe a few tokens thrown in for the left. Surely you don't see Biden as someone who's going to stray too far from the donor class' wishes? He's just a slightly shitter Obama.

Primarily their social justice position. But if I say that out loud I get branded a racist. In the democratically run states and cities we've seen an increase in crime and violence, and these places appear less stable. Worries me that a democratically run country would go more that way too. Just doesn't seen inclusive or focused on bringing people together. This country will always have race issues but this approach doesn't appear to be doing much good. I'm by no means saying Trump is the solution, but it's local govt. run by the democrats that appears to have gone to shit in recent months.

[RicoS321]

11 hours ago, LA-Don said:

Primarily their social justice position. But if I say that out loud I get branded a racist. In the democratically run states and cities we've seen an increase in crime and violence, and these places appear less stable. Worries me that a democratically run country would go more that way too. Just doesn't seen inclusive or focused on bringing people together. This country will always have race issues but this approach doesn't appear to be doing much good. I'm by no means saying Trump is the solution, but it's local govt. run by the democrats that appears to have gone to shit in recent months.

Not on here you won't, unless you're actually being racist. Point to a specific policy, tell us about it? I'd love to see your statistics on crime increase, and in what way they relate to policy? I don't buy it, basically, and you've probably seen my position on Biden and the Democratic party in general - it's not great. I'm just not convinced that there is a republican local government that is "doing it right" on crime compared to a democrat one. I'm guessing that if you overlaid poverty statistics and crime you'd get a pretty strong correlation and that if you overlaid poverty statistics and voting democrat you'd also get a pretty strong correlation. In other words, those who face the greatest pressures of inequality are more likely to commit crime and are more likely (though possibly incorrect) to believe that inequality would be reduced by voting democrat. Trump's use of the FBI statistics on crime to show "the top 10 most dangerous places" in the US was at best stupid, at worst, deceptive.

[Kowalski]

I’m calling it: anyone voting for Trump is an imbecile. 
 

His performance on the White House balcony the other night had a touch of Idi Amin about it. He’s a dangerous psychopath who will get what he deserves soon enough. 

[RicoS321]

12 hours ago, Kowalski said:

I’m calling it: anyone voting for Trump is an imbecile. 
 

His performance on the White House balcony the other night had a touch of Idi Amin about it. He’s a dangerous psychopath who will get what he deserves soon enough. 

I think that's a very simple view. I would also argue that anyone voting for Biden is an imbecile. But then that has to be weighed against the perceived "shame" of not voting at all, which would be my position if I were in the US. Anyone who votes in that American electoral system is validating an anti-democratic sham.

Whether Trump's speech had a touch of Idi Amin about it or not is largely irrelevant. In four years he's been largely - not completely - curtailed in anything he's tried to do that could be described as dangerous or pyschopathic. He's mainly held back by his own incompetence and lack of attention span. I don't see that changing with age. He's no Hitler, he doesn't have the ability. He's not even Steve Bannon. In fact, I'd go as far as to say that he's just a distraction that draws people into the minutae of his every utterance and throws up fake culture wars and arguments that take attention from the real issues.

[scotfree]

[tom_widdows]

BBC seem to be really slow on their website.

Following the Guardians feed and they've already called at least 2 states.
Now seems to be a selection of tweets about florida in which one moment its 'ooh trump is in trouble', then suddenly its 'ooh hilary was doing better in 2016, Biden better start praying;

Thought the UK was bad but FFS the yanks really have a desperatly corrupt and outdated election system. Now saying despite a court ruling at least 300000 votes were posted but wont be delivered therefore wont count.
 

[RicoS321]

7 hours ago, tom_widdows said:

Thought the UK was bad but FFS the yanks really have a desperatly corrupt and outdated election system. Now saying despite a court ruling at least 300000 votes were posted but wont be delivered therefore wont count.
 

I've been talking about that for twenty years, it's amazing how many folk either don't know that's what happens or seem to forget about it until the week/month before election day. The republicans have a fine tuned vote purging model that the democrats could only dream of. Trump has basically announced his victory, it will get tasty. They'll get Pennsylvania closed down shortly and call it for the republicans. That should be enough for four more years.

 

Edit: Arizona called for the democrats. Spoke to soon perhaps. How did the republicans let that one slip through the net? That'll be the supreme court on the case. Amy will have to step up.

Edited November 4, 2020 by RicoS321

[Kowalski]

Arizona was called Blue several hours ago by Fox News of all places.

Its such a horrific but strangely curious process to watch.

Trump still bookies favourite (just) but Biden has gone ahead in Wisconsin and if he takes that state I think needs 2 from Nevada, Michigan, Georgia & Pennsylvania?  They seem to be waiting on counts from big cities like Atlanta and Detroit which are seemingly Democratic.

It will likely go to court though.  But what a deeply divided country.

[RicoS321]

Wisconsin democrat. Biden's a shoe in now. Would think Michigan and Nevada will be democrat too. If he can get Pennsylvania and one other too then Trump will make less of a fuss I reckon. I think the Republicans will begin to start ditching him if any three further states go in the next while. They're like the Tories when it comes to moving from pander to ruthless disloyalty, it's impressive.

[LA-Don]

2 hours ago, RicoS321 said:

Wisconsin democrat. Biden's a shoe in now. Would think Michigan and Nevada will be democrat too. If he can get Pennsylvania and one other too then Trump will make less of a fuss I reckon. I think the Republicans will begin to start ditching him if any three further states go in the next while. They're like the Tories when it comes to moving from pander to ruthless disloyalty, it's impressive.

Yeah, it's over, I fully expect Biden to take Nevada, Michigan, and Wisconsin. I also wouldn't be surprised if he ended up winning one or more of Georgia, North Carolina, or Pennsylvania too. The bigger the winning margin the better for a smoother transition, the closer it is the more drama and legal shit to follow.

What this election has shown is the complete farce that is American media, as I've said here before. With the exception of Fox they pretty much all called a significant Biden win and have been for months. Same happened 4 years ago too if I recall. I'm sure the Trump side will argue that the one sided media and publicity also cost them the election.

It also tells you how divided the country is that a complete lunatic nearly wins. Again. The left scares so many. If this country was a child's toy we'd have thrown it away long ago. Don't see how things get close to being fixed. The republicans have 4 years to find a 'normal' candidate, although an 81 year old Biden surely will not run again in 4 years so they are maybe in the same boat. Maybe that's the fresh start needed?

[RicoS321]

1 hour ago, LA-Don said:

Yeah, it's over, I fully expect Biden to take Nevada, Michigan, and Wisconsin. I also wouldn't be surprised if he ended up winning one or more of Georgia, North Carolina, or Pennsylvania too. The bigger the winning margin the better for a smoother transition, the closer it is the more drama and legal shit to follow.

What this election has shown is the complete farce that is American media, as I've said here before. With the exception of Fox they pretty much all called a significant Biden win and have been for months. Same happened 4 years ago too if I recall. I'm sure the Trump side will argue that the one sided media and publicity also cost them the election.

It also tells you how divided the country is that a complete lunatic nearly wins. Again. The left scares so many. If this country was a child's toy we'd have thrown it away long ago. Don't see how things get close to being fixed. The republicans have 4 years to find a 'normal' candidate, although an 81 year old Biden surely will not run again in 4 years so they are maybe in the same boat. Maybe that's the fresh start needed?

There's nothing left about Biden. He's a centre right politician with centre right policies.

Fox news isn't a news channel. It's a conduit for the beliefs of Rupert. It contains zero fact. Full of bought and paid shysters and charlatans. I would hope that every single source of news had opposing views to fox, unless by coincidence.