DT Politics Thread

[rocket_scientist]

Tony Blair yesterday was putting nails in the Corbyn coffin. He's got some gall but he knows he's protected by the deep state. Had he not been and if "our values" did indeed include the rule of law, that cunt would've been in jail. How does a PM become a multi millionaire so soon after leaving a £120k p.a. (as it was back then) job, the highest civil service job in the UK? Do we not have investigative journalism any more asking these type of questions?

[rocket_scientist]

If you "stand by every word" TC, explain why you described Foot as "a nice man" and Corbyn as a cunt?

 

Also, you should actually read the manifesto and the detail before making big pronouncements. Otherwise it's not going to be a surprise that you come across as getting your information elsewhere rather than thinking for yourself.

[Tyrant]

I'm a member of the SNP (not an activist). The last thing you could accuse me of is falling for Tory propaganda. I remember when Brown waited a year too long to hold the election held in 2010 and cost Labour a victory. Now I forget which department it was but the Labour outgoing cabinet secretary of state left a note for the incoming Tory (it was a Tory not a LibDem) S.o.S on his desk saying "There's no money left"

 

It's what Labour do historically. And now having made a cunt of the election the different factions within the party are virtually in civil war with each other. So I make no apologies for my interpretation and stand by every fucking word.

 

 

That doesn't mean you're immune to their very wide net of nonsense. First I'm hearing of this note. Although it doesn't necessarily mean anything.

[rocket_scientist]

There was a note that said no money left. It was a sick thing to do but as most politicians are sick, not surprising.

[rocket_scientist]

Nippie sweetie Sturgeon - "Queen Nicola" as she's called by the fools - has just made an arse of herself.

 

At Bute House she's just gone full tilt for Indyref 2.

 

If Boris was clever, and Cummings IS, they should grant us it.

 

Then when it fails, the SNP will have put back this country for 50 years.

 

All because they didn't do their fucking job properly. It's all shite.

[rocket_scientist]

I'm a member of the SNP (not an activist).

 

I joined a political party once. In 1998. It was the SNP. I think it cost me £20. I didn't rejoin the following year. I can't remember if they even invited me to but even if they did post me a subs renewal, I would never have given those useless fuckers another penny.

 

All I got for my membership was to meet with somebody they said I had to meet (before I could join). It barely lasted 5 minutes but given the impression he made on me, I wanted out of there quicker than I wanted in. His cheap clothes and his unkempt appearance weren't the problem more than he was a loser, a small man who's face had never cracked a smile. The sickly hue and pallor of his face reminded us all that death was coming.

 

The political parties should think about the type of people they allow to represent them. Simple tasks like beating Bowie and the Tories in Scotland would be easier if they picked better canvassers and political representatives.

[Garlogie_Granite]

Nippie sweetie Sturgeon - "Queen Nicola" as she's called by the fools - has just made an arse of herself.

 

At Bute House she's just gone full tilt for Indyref 2.

 

If Boris was clever, and Cummings IS, they should grant us it.

 

Then when it fails, the SNP will have put back this country for 50 years.

 

All because they didn't do their fucking job properly. It's all shite.

We'll win indyref2, especially if your political forecasting record continues 

[Ten Caat]

We will win it if she picks the correct time. RS is correct though. If the Tories give the go ahead for it in 2020 we will lose. Sturgeon needs to calm her spam for 3 or 4 years until the UK is out of the EU and suffering the consequences. That will be the right time

[wee toon red]

The Scottish Government hasn't actually asked for permission to hold Indyref 2 in 2020, they've asked for the powers to decide when to hold a referendum be transferred to the Scottish Parliament. A small, but important, distinction.

[rocket_scientist]

We'll win indyref2, especially if your political forecasting record continues 

 

I hope you're right but I fear that you're wrong.

[rocket_scientist]

The Scottish Government hasn't actually asked for permission to hold Indyref 2 in 2020, they've asked for the powers to decide when to hold a referendum be transferred to the Scottish Parliament. A small, but important, distinction.

 

True but the effects, the result is the same. We still need Westminster to agree (to devolved power rather than the holding of the referendum).

 

All 39 pages available here: -

 

https://www.gov.scot/binaries/content/documents/govscot/publications/publication/2019/12/scotlands-right-choose-putting-scotlands-future-scotlands-hands/documents/scotlands-right-choose-putting-scotlands-future-scotlands-hands/scotlands-right-choose-putting-scotlands-future-scotlands-hands/govscot%3Adocument/scotlands-right-choose-putting-scotlands-future-scotlands-hands.pdf

[rocket_scientist]

Having now read every word of the first 27 pages - I didn't plough through Annex B (draft legislation) and only skimmed the end notes - it's a cleverly articulated and coherent case.

 

However, the TIMING of holding the referendum is absolutely key, as TC correctly says. I agree with him that now is NOT the right time.

 

The biggest thing I took from it was that the Yes vote in 2014 never got close. Page 22 presents the facts: -

 

2,001,926 votes were cast for ‘No’, and 1,617,989 votes were cast for ‘Yes’.

 

Only 44.7% of us voted for independence. The gulf between us and those who rejected independence was huge and given that there was an excellent 85% turnout, it was a clear vote to remain in the UK.

 

One of the biggest arguments in the document was material change (since 2014). Yes there have been seismic political changes since then but the ONLY material change that matters is that more Scots will vote Yes to independence than No and for that to happen, a majority of people living here need to believe it's best for our country. And that won't happen until somebody, anybody does the hard work and present a convincing case for it.

 

Nicola is arguing heavily on the right to choose without understanding that we will not choose Yes. At this point in time.

[Tyrant]

I joined a political party once. In 1998. It was the SNP. I think it cost me £20. I didn't rejoin the following year. I can't remember if they even invited me to but even if they did post me a subs renewal, I would never have given those useless fuckers another penny.

 

All I got for my membership was to meet with somebody they said I had to meet (before I could join). It barely lasted 5 minutes but given the impression he made on me, I wanted out of there quicker than I wanted in. His cheap clothes and his unkempt appearance weren't the problem more than he was a loser, a small man who's face had never cracked a smile. The sickly hue and pallor of his face reminded us all that death was coming.

 

The political parties should think about the type of people they allow to represent them. Simple tasks like beating Bowie and the Tories in Scotland would be easier if they picked better canvassers and political representatives.

 

I'm surprised to read that you apparently read so much into his clothes and appearance. Isn't the future of our country an infinitely bigger issue than how this one man comes across? I can't imagine being this offended by someone's appearance.

 

 

We'll win indyref2, especially if your political forecasting record continues 

 

 

The odds on us winning Indyref2 must be looooong though. I don't know how you cunts are going to manage it but I hope you do.

[rocket_scientist]

I'm surprised to read that you apparently read so much into his clothes and appearance. Isn't the future of our country an infinitely bigger issue than how this one man comes across? I can't imagine being this offended by someone's appearance.

 

I said his awful appearance was NOT a problem if you re-read what I wrote. I was very surprised however that someone welcoming a new member, or evaluating a new application or whatever the fuck he was doing would be such an appalling specimen of a human being.

 

I have always voted SNP so his being had no effect on my decisions on how to vote. He did cost the party my annual subscription and membership however (plus the fact I never heard anything from them the whole year).

[rocket_scientist]

True but the effects, the result is the same. We still need Westminster to agree (to devolved power rather than the holding of the referendum).

 

All 39 pages available here: -

 

https://www.gov.scot/binaries/content/documents/govscot/publications/publication/2019/12/scotlands-right-choose-putting-scotlands-future-scotlands-hands/documents/scotlands-right-choose-putting-scotlands-future-scotlands-hands/scotlands-right-choose-putting-scotlands-future-scotlands-hands/govscot%3Adocument/scotlands-right-choose-putting-scotlands-future-scotlands-hands.pdf

 

Boris didn't take long to say no. The key question that no journalist dare ask is "why are you, like your predecessors May and Cameron so desperate that Scotland does not become independent?"

 

They've already tried creative accounting and revisions to the Barnett formula etc. etc. to convince everyone that we are better off as part of the UK. They will cite the oil downturn as further "evidence" that we can't go it alone, should they ever allow the debate to take place.

 

But strong leadership requires decisive action and until nippie sweetie gets off her useless fucking arse and put forward a fully-costed case for independence, the majority of people living here won't vote for it. She needs to think through ALL the implications that independence would bring which means "divorce terms" and the logistics for the public and private concerns including the NHS, Bank of Scotland etc. etc. It also includes the "marriage terms" between an independent Scotland and the EU she's so desperate to rejoin.

 

Almost 4 out of 10 of us voted to leave the EU. We are as invisible to "Queen Nicola" as the more than 11 out of 20 Scots who voted against independence. Salmond failed cos he was an unconvincing slippery pig. Sturgeon will fail unless she directs her attentions away from the process (of how to get Indyref 2 to happen) and turns to the substance that will make or break our decision. Their poor record of government for the whole of this decade isn't helping. Boris could be right that she would be better advised to do her fucking day job better. They're not even getting the basics right.

[rocket_scientist]

"The tories won the election because they are proficient liars, and the media didn’t challenge them. Labour lost the election because they are ineffective truth tellers, and the media challenged, smeared and totally misrepresented them".

 

"If you are not angry, you are not paying attention".

 

These two quotes - one new, one older - appeal to me. The internet can truly be a wonderful thing.

 

Given the "media monopoly" or the "media consistency", the fact that the vast majority of the output consumed by the vast majority of citizens (particularly in the news and current affairs feeds) derives from the same state agenda, the internet may be the only source of truth available to anyone interested in finding it.

 

In the UK, I find Channel 4 News to be the least offensive in terms of reporting and they have occasionally exposed stuff that other media wouldn't dare but as an optimist, I'm wondering if the depth has now been reached and that the tide may be about to change?

 

As newspapers are invisible to me, I'm talking about coonsil telly here. With ITV broadcasting Pilger's superb documentary two nights ago (albeit under Ofcom's disgusting conditions) and Channel 4's The Cure last night, might this signal more truth being made more widely available to the masses? The optimist within me certainly hopes so.

 

Politics can only work effectively when "false propaganda" (lies) fails to win the day. It is my impression that greater numbers of people are becoming more aware but there is still a mountain to climb and we are at the very bottom of it.

 

The BBC, ITV and Sky News channels love to get citizens to give their political opinions in street interviews during elections and the type of people they select are always of a particular demographic, knowing full well that their ability to influence others who are similarly incapable of coherent thoughts fits their purpose. It's also self-validation, a twisted celebration of the fruits of their labours as the masses regurgitate the same sentiments that the media planted there.

 

It's all been shite for a very long time. I have faith that it can only get better. Education doesn't need to be onerous. The instruments of it are freely available (at present) and Corbyn wanted to enshrine that with free broadband.

 

Edit: I forgot to mention the role of film. Ken Loach continues to produce superb output but won't be widely seen by the deltas and the epsilons*. Not enough "action" as he doesn't favour high speed car chases, spectacular crashes, lots of blood and mass killings. With mandatory special effects of course. BBC and ITV should support our best film makers and support truth.

 

* I know that my terminology is offensive (to the heart) although some will recognise my reference to the late great Aldous Huxley. There were coal miners and factory workers who were supremely gifted artists and musicians. The "masses" by definition fails to recognise the individuality of each and every one of us but as the likes of the media and political strategists well know, you have to deal with and target "classes" of people when delivering effective propaganda. Truth tellers similarly need to be ruthless.

 

 

[Garlogie_Granite]

 

The odds on us winning Indyref2 must be looooong though. I don't know how you cunts are going to manage it but I hope you do.

As of right now, only Paddy's are offering odds, and they are 5/6 each. The bookies literally can't take a view, so they're in hiding. They're offering odds on next SNP leader for instance, which could be a decade away, but only one bookmaker is prepared to offer anything on indyref, and they cant make up their mind. You can't go on what the bookies offer as I've said a million times, but, with just about any possible market available on british politics, they literally don't have a clue on this one. Astonishing times

[Garlogie_Granite]

Rocket min, do us a favour, go and sign up to Golf Monthly forum, just got banned on a second account their, Totally run by guffs, first account banned for insisting on calling Huns Huns. Second ban today in the scottish independence thread for saying literally "shit". What a bunch of absolute guffy fannies. I think you would go down well there 

[wee toon red]

Rocket min, do us a favour, go and sign up to Golf Monthly forum, just got banned on a second account their, Totally run by guffs, first account banned for insisting on calling Huns Huns. Second ban today in the scottish independence thread for saying literally "shit". What a bunch of absolute guffy fannies. I think you would go down well there 

 

Hugh Jars by any chance? Contributed to that thread a couple of times yesterday, went on our work night out last night and it appears absolute carnage took place on the thread?

[rocket_scientist]

Rocket min, do us a favour, go and sign up to Golf Monthly forum, just got banned on a second account their, Totally run by guffs, first account banned for insisting on calling Huns Huns. Second ban today in the scottish independence thread for saying literally "shit". What a bunch of absolute guffy fannies. I think you would go down well there 

 

There is no Scottish Independence thread that I can see, certainly not active in the last 2+ weeks.

 

If you're not just making shit up and spouting shite again and you really had been excluded from that forum, there will have been good reasons for it. I could understand these reasons.

[RicoS321]

I really like Jess Phillips.

 

Kiss of death min. Pulling out of the leadership race. Shame. It'd have been good to hear more from her.

[Kowalski]

SNP doing their best to squander the chance that BoJo & Brexit has given them.

[ayrshire_don74]

own goal really they gave known about mackays ‘peccadillos’ , for ages but done nothing

[Ten Caat]

When they lowered the age of consent for homosexuals to 16 it was roundly supported by the SNP. There were no caveats that a 16 year old could only have sex with someone of a broadly similar age. As long as the texting started after the boy was 16, Mackay has broken no laws, in fact even if the boy was 15 I'm not sure he would have broken any laws either as long as no sexual activity took place. So I'm failing to see why this has become a resignation matter with Sturgeon criticising his behaviour. The age of consent must be fully applicable in every case, otherwise the law is an ass.

 

Of course this is the last thing the SNP need at a time when polls show that Scots are now (very) narrowly in favour of independence. This negative publicity on top of Salmond's trial next month must have the remainers rubbing their hands with glee.

 

[RicoS321]

Homosexual grooming isn't different to heterosexual grooming. It's not acceptable for a 42 year old of any gender or preference to groom a 16 year old. It's sick, and sturgeon should have called it out as such. We don't need laws to tell us what is morally unacceptable. The cunt needs help.