Kowalski Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 There's a lot of talk (elsewhere) about poor crowds this season. So lets get some FACTS in the way of a good argument... Average attendances at Pittodrie (the only ones I could lay my hands on): 2002-03: 11,775 2003-04: 10,389 2004-05: 13,577 2005-06: 12,727 2006-07: 12,475 2007-08 (to 2nd January): 12,408 So crowds are much the same as they have been for the last three years, not the huge drop in numbers that some moaners would have us believe. And crowds are better now than they were in the era immediately before JC arrived. In saying that, we should be aspiring to an average of 15,000. So what is the real reason for crowds being poor? For some it may be the lack of entertainment on display (but we've got great home form this season), while others it will be the rising costs of football, or other commitments. My view is that its probably a combination of the above. Football in general is seeing falling crowds, and complaints about the lack of atmosphere and entertainment across the whole of Britain (good article at http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/7168641.stm). I think that rather than blame the football on display at Pittodrie for the (alleged) falling crowds, Pittodrie is just going the same way as a lot of other grounds across the country. The rising costs are the main reason for the poor attendances IMHO. Given we're on the brink of (hopefully) having the best season for 20 years, its the stay away fans that are missing out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dons_1903 Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Those averages are terrible too, though! There's absolutely no improvement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Personally I blame the 67 that are staying away this season Good post by the way mate Cost is without doubt a huge issue, obviously made worse because of the number of games we are being faced with just now [ albeit wouldn't have it any other way ] My son's mate and his father went down to a Bolton game o'er Xmas and paid £20 for the pair of them to get in. We went to Love Street on Sat and were £30 for us, and yesterday were £29 at Pittodrie. Enough said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanderark14 Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Personally I blame the 67 that are staying away this season Good post by the way mate Cost is without doubt a huge issue, obviously made worse because of the number of games we are being faced with just now [ albeit wouldn't have it any other way ] My son's mate and his father went down to a Bolton game o'er Xmas and paid £20 for the pair of them to get in. We went to Love Street on Sat and were £30 for us, and yesterday were £29 at Pittodrie. Enough said theres one significant difference between us and Bolton though. they are guarenteed a bumper cheque at the beginning of the season from sky so they can afford to do this. we get the scraps from the old firm after setanta hand out the tv cash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 It took a lot of effort for me not to leave at half time yesterday, it was dire stuff. The only thing that keeps me going at the moment is that I always manage to persuade myself to buy a season ticket every summer. There's no way I'd pay £21 to watch that utter garbage on offer. Too much emphasis is being put on entertainment. Entertainment to me is playing basic football to a good standard, we're not even doing that. We're only getting away with it because most of the teams in the league are just as bad, if not, worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BTR Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Much though I agree that we should be aspiring for a figure of around 15k, where is the historical precedent for this? Even in the mid-80s during our most successful period, were we averaging 15k? Aberdeen's population has been decreasing steadily for the last 15 years (although to be fair, much of the decrease has been absorbed with an increase in the shire) and basic maths may tell you that a 10% decrease in population will give you a 10% decrease in support. Or maybe I'm being pedantic... Some of us want to see us win at any cost. Some people want to see us win well. Some people want to see an entertaining spectacle. The team gets the support it deserves. In other words, regardless of which of these categories you fall under, the standard of football/entertainment level needs to rise to encourage these so-called stay-away fans. Maybe we simply need to buy a "flair" player and whip up a frenzy about him the way that we did with Zerouali or Hignett. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 theres one significant difference between us and Bolton though. they are guarenteed a bumper cheque at the beginning of the season from sky so they can afford to do this. we get the scraps from the old firm after setanta hand out the tv cash Of course you're right about that, but was just trying to highlight the uneven playing field we're operating in. Another example was pre season, myself and the bairn went down to St James for game against Juve. Fiver for a thirteen year old and a tenner for an auld fucker like me. Contrast that against us, who wouldn't take a friendly against Ajax, because we couldn't guarantee to cover their costs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lurker Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 I C'mon lad...... spit it oot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jute Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Average gate this year is being boosted 3 the Uefa home games. Anyone worked out what they are just for the domestic games? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lurker Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 have a stutter . . . I think some of the blame is due to poor promotion of the games - even buying a ticket is a chore (even more so this season). you either have to plod all the way down to the stadium during office hours or buy online / over the phone and have them posted or pick them up Surely there should at least be one outlet in town selling tickets (the clubshop? tourist information?). Also, there are 2 universities in the town but is anything done to entice students along? I've been through 2 degrees at RGU and never saw a thing from AFC - similarly there should be more done to get schoolkids along. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kowalski Posted January 3, 2008 Author Share Posted January 3, 2008 Average gate this year is being boosted 3 the Uefa home games. Anyone worked out what they are just for the domestic games? Those figures are SPL games only. Also, there are 2 universities in the town but is anything done to entice students along? I've been through 2 degrees at RGU and never saw a thing from AFC - similarly there should be more done to get schoolkids along. Good shout. I'm pretty sure that there used to be a student season ticket on the go. Specially reduced rate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nellie The Don Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Those figures are SPL games only. Good shout. I'm pretty sure that there used to be a student season ticket on the go. Specially reduced rate. Students count as concessions wrt season tickets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caledonia Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 I have not being going so much this season for the following reasons 1 - cost with 3 kids its to much at times 2 - As im a bit older i remember the days when we had class players not the average, solid aw well they gave 100% players we have nowadays 3 - tv you can watch any number of games although i prefer the match the kids dont mind watching football on the telly 4 -stewart milne why am i expected to pay a fortune to watch the matches when a man earning in excess of 2 million a year pays fuckall (and dont give me the crap about aberdeen being self financing) he could at least pay off the debt the clubs in.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasgow sheep Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 3 - tv you can watch any number of games although i prefer the match the kids dont mind watching football on the telly The EPL and the Champions League have a lot to answer for. The over exposure these competitions have given to a few over hyped mega-clubs is one main reason for declining crowds. Folk watch their football in the comfort of their own home or in the pub, get to see the game from dozens of angles, have expert analysis from famous former players and "charismatic" experts, all in HD and the rest of it. Hardly surprising that being stuck in the cold with an inferior view means that even if there is not as big a difference in the quality as is made out they find it some what under whelming. Just take a look round town. How many ManU, Arsenal, Chelsea, Barca, Milan shirts do see kids wearing. Most could real off most the squad for these teams but would struggle to name a falkirk or motherwell player. I fucking hate EPL, The Champions League and Murdoch with his empire promoting it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Mambo Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Used to be a highland league regular years ago (during the huntly glory years) and the standard of football on offer was good. Always entertaining. Most of the teams who played back then at least tried to play on the deck and string the passes together. Also, on occasions Huntly played Premier league teams in the cup, more often than not they were the better team outplaying them for most of the match. It was the professional side who would just lump it upfield and go for free kicks or rely on their superior fitness to get them through. Sometimes I watch AFC and wonder what they do all week as they can't even get the basics (i.e pass to a player in the same coloured shirt) right. Also, do we have a midfield? Oh, to have the likes of Jim bett spraying the passes and linking the play instead of just lumping it up for Miller to head on. Can't argue with the season so far mind. Just wish we'd play a bit of football more often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kowalski Posted January 4, 2008 Author Share Posted January 4, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasgow sheep Posted January 4, 2008 Share Posted January 4, 2008 what a bonnie graph and from that we can conclude our crowds have always been as good/bad (delete as appropriate) I think our attendances were probably better in the 90s but we lost a fair few, never to return after nightmares like A.Miller. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyBiscuit Posted January 4, 2008 Share Posted January 4, 2008 The EPL and the Champions League have a lot to answer for. The over exposure these competitions have given to a few over hyped mega-clubs is one main reason for declining crowds. Folk watch their football in the comfort of their own home or in the pub, get to see the game from dozens of angles, have expert analysis from famous former players and "charismatic" experts, all in HD and the rest of it. Hardly surprising that being stuck in the cold with an inferior view means that even if there is not as big a difference in the quality as is made out they find it some what under whelming. Just take a look round town. How many ManU, Arsenal, Chelsea, Barca, Milan shirts do see kids wearing. Most could real off most the squad for these teams but would struggle to name a falkirk or motherwell player. I fucking hate EPL, The Champions League and Murdoch with his empire promoting it what a bonnie graph and from that we can conclude our crowds have always been as good/bad (delete as appropriate) I think our attendances were probably better in the 90s but we lost a fair few, never to return after nightmares like A.Miller. so really, it has fuck all to do with the EPL and Champions League. The Champions League is played midweek on nights we don't have games and live EPL isn't on at Sat 3pm. The standard of football is utter guff, and anyone who has ever watched ANY football, or who has ever played ANY football can see that the fare is poor and you certainly do not need any comparison with the EPL or the CL to come to that conclusion. Perhaps you should credit people with coming to their own conclusions rather than subscribing to the popular myth that Sky Sports command our brains. I go to watch Maryhill Juniors sometimes on a Saturday and pay a few quid to get in. Is there £16 worth of difference between their standard and AFC's play? Not a fucking chance. Our players are undoubtedly of higher standard with better technique, but as far as the standard of general play goes it's garbage. Utter garbage. And I don't need any television station to tell me that when I can see it with my own eyes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TENEMENTFUNSTER Posted January 4, 2008 Share Posted January 4, 2008 Old football was very very very shit too folks. This romanticised notion that old football was better really has to be fucked now. There are just more ways for people to waste their weekends. But to suggest that over-exposure of CL and EPL games hasn't affected crowds throughout Britain really is just nonsense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyBiscuit Posted January 4, 2008 Share Posted January 4, 2008 Old football was very very very shit too folks. This romanticised notion that old football was better really has to be fucked now. There are just more ways for people to waste their weekends. But to suggest that over-exposure of CL and EPL games hasn't affected crowds throughout Britain really is just nonsense. I'm not talking about "throughout Britain". I'm talking about AFC. Look at the average attendances for the last 20 years or so, it's always been shit. Going on memory, we averaged about 15-16k when we were the best side in Europe. Maybe, just maybe, the support just isn't there. Or, if it is, as you say there are other options for people to spend their money on. Either way, it's obvious there just isn't enough of a hardcore support as we'd all like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TENEMENTFUNSTER Posted January 4, 2008 Share Posted January 4, 2008 Completely agree, there is a seeming ambivolence to AFC from the Aberdeen public that seems always to have been there and is difficult to understand despite the increased competition for attention from other sources of Saturday avo entertainment. With a "one team city" and a population of Aberdeen's size you'd think a relatively successful team would attract much more than we have of late. That much is disappointing but in keeping with other exaples I guess. Middlesboro are a one team town too and thier crowds are piss poor despite having more real success than ever before over the last few years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capitalsharpie Posted January 4, 2008 Share Posted January 4, 2008 Also remember that the attendance of both of the ugly sisters is skewed in that they have half of ireland emptying each week to bulk up there support. I actuall wonder if you were to stop THESE biggots going if their attendance would drop to AROUND ours and hearts??? I realise that weegieland is a vastly larger city, but i reckin thier attendance would drop to around 20-25k? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caledonia Posted January 5, 2008 Share Posted January 5, 2008 Yes but they would still have the so called glory hunters that are all around me.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Caroline B Posted January 5, 2008 Share Posted January 5, 2008 Too many other attractions are around and at cheaper prices in a warmer climate. Personally I find a stroll around town in and out of the shops a better attraction sometimes. The fact that my hubby got me a season ticket stops me from doing so. The attraction was even stronger against Inverness to do so. Clubs need to to do more to attract fans and they should start with pricing for certain matches. And not by a couple of quid either! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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