Victims v Dons

[rocket_scientist]

^

 

Brilliant post bb.

 

Nailed.

 

[LA-Don]

We fucked up the Flood situation. He was under contract yet we give him a freebie. Why not release him once we've signed a replacement, or at least get something in return? Grass is always greener, but i was open about him being a good player for us and I agree, we missed him today. I'd also argue Paul Quinn could do a job for us....

 

Shinnie and O'Connor can't be faulted for effort but a team with top of the league ambitions should not be playing these guys as our main midfielders, alongside a guy lacking in confidence and off form who should have been dropped weeks ago. O'Connor was subbed instead of Reynolds I'd assume since Reynolds has the pace, yet I think he got beat for speed on the penalty? And what does Craig Storie need to do to get a game, he did well last year?!?!

 

With the current squad we're a mid table team and the first 4 games, plus the league cup, have shown that. That's not a knee jerk reaction, very obvious reality.

[rocket_scientist]

^

 

You and I see the same picture dude.

 

And yet when I suggested the season was over after two games, some cunt took offence.

 

He was from the English city within Scotland right enough.

 

Which makes him a Fud by default.

[Edinburghdon]

^

 

You and I see the same picture dude.

 

And yet when I suggested the season was over after two games, some cunt took offence.

 

He was from the English city within Scotland right enough.

 

Which makes him a Fud by default.

 

Slow learner aren't you rocket?... For probably about the millionth time, neither from Edinburgh nor live there anymore. Apart from that carry on.

 

I'll give you the cunt bit though 

 

[rocket_scientist]

Slow learner aren't you rocket?... For probably about the millionth time, neither from Edinburgh nor live there anymore. Apart from that carry on.

 

I'll give you the cunt bit though 

 

Relax dude. It's a fitba forum. Who gives a fuck about "you" or "me", virtual or otherwise.

 

Would like to hear where your optimism stems from however.

 

What have you been seeing in our first 8 or 9 games this season that means it's NOT going to be a long hard slog of a miserable year? On or off the pitch?

[Edinburghdon]

Relax dude. It's a fitba forum. Who gives a fuck about "you" or "me", virtual or otherwise.

 

Would like to hear where your optimism stems from however.

 

What have you been seeing in our first 8 or 9 games this season that means it's NOT going to be a long hard slog of a miserable year? On or off the pitch?

 

Just correcting you that's all 

 

Oh I've never said I'm bursting with optimism, only that to write our season off as over after a poor start (once which has a challenging run of games in close succession) is overkill in my opinion. That's all!

[rocket_scientist]

Just correcting you that's all 

 

Oh I've never said I'm bursting with optimism, only that to write our season off as over after a poor start (once which has a challenging run of games in close succession) is overkill in my opinion. That's all!

 

Well that's an argument of sorts I suppose.

 

Maybe it would be nice if you could give your opinion some justification?

 

When you're so quick to attack another view, it implies that you have a view of your own?

 

What did I say that was so wrong?

 

I pray to God/Buddha/Allah - whoever the fuck - I'm wrong.

 

What are you seeing that convinces you I'm wrong?

[manc_don]

Aberdeen scorer Adam Rooney, reflecting on the Dons' 4-1 defeat by Celtic in Glasgow on Saturday, points out: "If you take the two goals late on out of it, it was a 2-1 game". (Daily Record)

 

Not having a go at Rooney here as it is an isolated quote but that is a silly thing to say. Regardless of whether it was a 10-1 or 2-1 game, it was a loss. That is the long and short of it.  Rooney obviously did his job on the weekend, shame others couldn't or weren't allowed to.

[tom_widdows]

And if Celtic hadn't scored 4 it would have been a 1-0 win.

 

Was he possessed by the ghost of Jim Farry?

[tlg1903]

Come on man. Worth a point? In what universe? We had fucking surrendered before a ball had been kicked. McInnes didn't think we could win that game and it showed. That was a hideous first half and frankly, embarrassing. He went there expecting to get his arse felt and it happened, but it took much longer for it to happen because guess what...? Celtic aren't as good as our boss clearly thinks they are.

 

Rooney's finish was superb, his movement and anticipation equally so. No matter how poor we are, he can do something for us in the box, we all know it. He then gets bumped out to the right. Then he gets hooked at 2-1 with 7 minutes left. When we need a goal, we take off the one guy who gets us goals. It's bewildering and tiresome.

 

Know who would have been handy today? Willo Flood. Shame we let him leave and then never replaced him. What about Craig Storie to help shore things up? Gets on at 90 mins when the jig was well and truly up but we have Kenny McLean mincing about the midfield for us trying not to break a fingernail.

 

We were fucking garbage today, let's not pretend otherwise. Aye, the ref made a pig's ear of the penalty decision but we had already shot ourselves in the foot with the first half submission.  That wasn't the performance or attitude of a title contending side.

 

The writing has been on the wall. We are struggling, and DM now has a fortnight to knit his squad together because at the moment we are utterly disjointed and devoid of ideas.

 

In the universe where we were the better side for the second half, celtic never looked like scoring until the depressingly predictable dodgy pen.  If it had gone 2-2 at any point leading up to that we would have been worth it. 

That said I don't disagree with some of your other points.  One of the frustrating things about DM is he is far too cautious and that clearly showed with the attempt to stifle Celtic.  I can understand the logic, they're on fire going forward and have been particularly potent straight from the traps so keep it tight at the back to frustrate the sizeable crowd before growing into the game.  It might have worked too if not for a Griffiths worldie.  Within this context whether we like it or not he was unlikely to take the game to them from KO.  I don't for a second buy that MacInnes didn't think we could have them though.

 

Flood might have been useful yesterday I grant you but he could just as easily been a red card inside half an hour.  He's lost a yard of place and hasn't adapted his challenges to match.  I suspect he was let go on a free because he was on quite big money and unlikely to feature much this season. It's the lack of an adequate replacement that's the problem with him leaving not that he left.

 

There's no doubt that they were there for the taking and yes we could have played better but there were still some positives to take from the game. 

 

Lots of other valid points have been made re Smith, Mckenna and Wright, I'd love to see them get more game-time.  I was chuffed for CS to get a loan to utd but I did wonder at the time if we were missing a trick letting him go but, then,  I've always rated the kid. 

 

It does seem that DM's honeymoon is well and truly over though. Combine some baffling tactical decisions (with a particular penchant for for playing key players out of position), an increasingly hit or miss transfer record (including outs and failure to address the lack of options in one position whilst being overstaffed in others)

and the refusal to give youth a chance and you get a clearly growing and understandable frustration amongst the support.  If things continue like they are it won't be too long until there are calls for his head from some sections.  Given the board is highly unlikely to want to pay out a 2019 contract I don't see that happening anytime soon.  I suspect we are going to have to continue to suck it up for a while and hope it gets better.  Tom's signature springs to mind. 

 

I must confess I have contemplated that I would not be particularly gutted if DM was poached by another club and we were to take Tommy Wright from ST J......

[BobbyBiscuit]

In the universe where we were the better side for the second half, celtic never looked like scoring until the depressingly predictable dodgy pen. If it had gone 2-2 at any point leading up to that we would have been worth it. 

 

 

But it didn't and we weren't.  The first half was an abject shambles from us, a real hark back to the days of Aitken, A Miller and Skovdahl going there knowing we were going to get battered. Do we just forget that because there was an improvement in the second half?  We were playing a team who are good going forward but clearly weak at the back with a new keeper in who didn't know his defence, so we decide to sit back and invite them on to us.  I'm not convinced that's the right way to go in those circumstances

[LA-Don]

It's definitely early doors for this season but the Celtic game highlighted our problem. We don't have a strong midfield and when behind we have no subs to freshen up the midfield. At 2-1 Celtic didn't need to chase the game, it's easy to say we played well but, ultimately, we started badly and 4-1 is 4-1.Unless we sign at least 2 midfielders in the next few days this won't change and I'd see this as a really poor window. Yes, Jack and Pawlett will get healthy but what happens when Shinnie or McLean are injured/suspended. It's also interesting that Pawlett has done nothing to suggest improvement to gain more playing time; he's just playing by default, we have nobody else.

 

DM has done a great job and I'm a fan. However, he's now at the stage where I wonder if he's taken us as far as he can. This season will be a real challenge at finishing second and he's being questioned more and more, plus there will be more grumbles and abuse from the fans. His signings and tactics are being scrutinized more than ever and I wonder how long he'll last. Don't see us getting rid of him but will he move on citing finances/lack of and he's taken us as far as he can?

[tlg1903]

But it didn't and we weren't.  The first half was an abject shambles from us, a real hark back to the days of Aitken, A Miller and Skovdahl going there knowing we were going to get battered. Do we just forget that because there was an improvement in the second half?  We were playing a team who are good going forward but clearly weak at the back with a new keeper in who didn't know his defence, so we decide to sit back and invite them on to us.  I'm not convinced that's the right way to go in those circumstances

 

It's certainly not the way I would have gone but I'm way more cavalier about such things. 

[RicoS321]

But it didn't and we weren't.  The first half was an abject shambles from us, a real hark back to the days of Aitken, A Miller and Skovdahl going there knowing we were going to get battered. Do we just forget that because there was an improvement in the second half?  We were playing a team who are good going forward but clearly weak at the back with a new keeper in who didn't know his defence, so we decide to sit back and invite them on to us.  I'm not convinced that's the right way to go in those circumstances

 

^^^This. It wasn't the decision to sit back at the start, it was the extent to which we did it. 90% possession or something in the first half. It was unacceptable, and a little embarrassing. It sent out a loser message to the players and fans. There was no way they were going to have the belief to win that game.

[BobbyBiscuit]

^^^This. It wasn't the decision to sit back at the start, it was the extent to which we did it. 90% possession or something in the first half. It was unacceptable, and a little embarrassing. It sent out a loser message to the players and fans. There was no way they were going to have the belief to win that game.

 

He over-estimated his opponents and under-estimated his own players. A bad combination.  It sends a horrible message to his own players; almost that he doesn't trust them if he lets them off the leash.

[LA-Don]

I think we tend to over complicate things. We don't need to play one up top and defend because of the ability of the other team. While that is more the norm of top league football I still think we can play two up top and go at teams. Don't think anyone in Scotland is that good where a conservative approach is needed. I'd like to see teams have to adjust to play us and don't feel we really need to for anyone.

[BobbyBiscuit]

I think we tend to over complicate things. We don't need to play one up top and defend because of the ability of the other team. While that is more the norm of top league football I still think we can play two up top and go at teams. Don't think anyone in Scotland is that good where a conservative approach is needed. I'd like to see teams have to adjust to play us and don't feel we really need to for anyone.

 

Agreed.  Celtic is the one team I think two sitters in midfield may be required, but playing that way and one up front against Thistle or Killie is just overkill. It's not required and hampers us in a way.

[rocket_scientist]

DM has done a great job and I'm a fan.

 

We will agree to disagree. He's done an ok job and I'm not a fan because...

 

However, he's now at the stage where I wonder if he's taken us as far as he can.

 

I totally agree. I think he's run out of the early promise that we thought which is why I disagree that HE will move on...

 

I wonder how long he'll last. Don't see us getting rid of him but will he move on citing finances/lack of and he's taken us as far as he can?

 

because I don't see anyone bigger coming in for him when he's clearly making big mistakes at us.

[LA-Don]

I know the term great is certainly subjective but if you look at where we are now, the realistic expectation of a table topping challenge, pretty much the second best team in Scotland for the last three years, league challenging until late into the season, and for the most part solid performances in Europe, DM has definitely given us a higher level of credibility. Having lived through the Fergie era and all that followed, we're certainly no longer a laughing stock and compete at the right end of the table. It's not been this way for a long time. If you mean great as in winning the league and multiple trophies like the Ferguson era or close to, then we're certainly not there. Maybe he's not great but I think he's better than ok.

 

I think he's taken us as far as he can and/or the budget can. We can all play arm chair managers and second guess coaching, tactics, subbing, formation etc but we don't know the training and the internal development and issues of the players and team. This is the first time I've really questioned him with the farcical situation of our midfield but, at the same time, if we want to improve the team that pretty much takes cash we haven't spent in a long time. DM has done what he's done paying for 1 player, the rest freebies and loans. If we want higher quality than a McGinn, Jack, McLean, Taylor, etc that costs money we don't appear to have, either in transfer fees or weekly wage.

 

In terms of someone bigger coming for him, that's subjective too. He can make more money and have a bigger budget at a championship or div 1 team, is that bigger? I don't think so but some may argue it is. I could totally see him going to the championship and potentially taking McGinn, Rooney, Hayes and the likes with him.

 

I'm not happy where we are right now, it's going to be a make or break season for DM and this squad.

[rocket_scientist]

Like I said, we will need to disagree.

 

His record isn't good enough to attract interest from clubs with bigger budgets.

 

As others have said, there's clearly something very wrong at AFC.

 

The apologist or the fool might expect it to turn round by itself whilst ignoring the root causes.

 

An ambitious man, one who burns to win - desire being what separates the best from the rest - wouldn't be happy with his own team's performances and would strive to win more.

 

A competent manager would not have glaring imbalances in his squad.

 

I fear he's like every other manager recruited by the chairman. Just not very good at his job. But in a background where Allardyce is considered international class and Wenger still hasn't been dispensed with, it's not a given that even the employers have any idea what it takes to win although in Sam's case, I have an awful feeling that he might do well enough to win something. There are too many excellent talents in England right now.

[manc_don]

Finally decided to give the games highlights a watch today. The defending was absolutely horrific and actually reminded me of something Alan Shearer of all people said on MOTD on the weekend. Problem when you have 5 at the back (although for griffiths goal is was 6 and all flat) people end up having no-one to mark and get confused.  That is precisely what happened there. Fuck me, get the basics right at least to give yourself a fighting chance. DM sold the team up the river.

 

Good finish from Rooney, scored from absolutely nothing.