Quarterly Progress Report

[1903_Redz]

Usually 11 games in means we've now played everyone once, except obviously this time we've played the Dhims twice whilst still waiting to play Murderwell.

 

Anyway, it's a bit unfortunate really to be in the situation i've just described above as playing that horrible bastards again has put a different slant on how it looked previous to meeting them for the 2nd time.

 

My opinion of the season so far is we're pretty much where i expected (pre Dhims game). I'm very pleased with our goalkeeper and our defence has options and O'Connor has been just as big a success as Joe in goals.

 

The midfield has been given a new lease of life with our young loanee, he seems to make everyone around him step up their level a degree or so. Unfortunately he wasn't on the pitch the same time as McGinn on Sat so unsure if even he'd have been able to make McGinn produce a decent performance against his previous employers... i doubt it tho.

 

Up front we've more options but McInnes doesn't like to venture far from the tried and tested route, so Rooney up top on his own is still the norm.

 

To summarise i think the team are doing pretty well, we've got a cup final to look forward to. With the exception of the Manky Mob i think we're better than everyone else but still struggle to prove it at times, therefore i think we'll struggle in to 2nd.

McInnes is very loyal to certain players meaning others don't get the chance they probably deserve. He has got us to the first cup final of the year and signed a couple of quality players so i'm going to give him and the team a.....

 

B+

 

Thoughts?

[Flyfishing]

Yep - nothing I disagree with. I do think there are real positives in Big Joe and O'Connor but for me there are key players not doing as well as I had hoped namely McLean and Rooney. B for me, reasonable start but could do better!

[rocket_scientist]

Depends what the pass mark is. If C is a pass and D is a fail, it's C minus for me so far.

 

Getting to a final is nothing to celebrate. Who did we beat to get there? And what's the point of getting to the final if we're just going to get horsed? Not saying that we will but the act of beating shit to get the chance to "compete" v. Celtic is nothing achieved yet.

 

Win the final and he gets an A minus this YTD but with the league finished for us early doors and nailed shut before the end of October, I can't see that he merits anything other than a bare pass mark just now. In fact, given the players he's got, he's not been motivating them consistently well nor has he been playing the right players in the right positions often enough.

[LA-Don]

I'd give us a C, a pass, but not a lot more. We should be better than last year with the additions of Lewis, O'Connor, Maddison, and Stockley, but we're not. After 11 games we're 5-3-3 (18 pts), last year we were 8-3 (24 pts.) Some signings have been questionable (why Morris and Storey??) Maddison has somewhat saved our arse, we were really poor in league up until his arrival. Will be really interesting to see how we do after he leaves in January. We should be the second best team and I expect us to be - however, I still think it will be a struggle for second against Hearts and Rangers.

 

As for the cup, it's great being in a final but I'll judge that based on the performance in the final. To win 3 games to get to a final is a bit farcical, but if we go with the defensive tactics of this past weekend we'll get beat and it will be a real negative experience.

[1903_Redz]

Having read the replies i'm now thinking i've been overly generous to DM.

 

RS and LA,D are spot on and have me realising i was over egging the fact we've qualified for the LCF without doing a great deal to get there.

 

Perhaps i was too keen to keep an upbeat outlook after the game against the Dhims at the weekend....

 

I dread to think where we'd be without James Maddison this last few weeks.

 

There's plenty i'd like to see DM change but he's not going to as he's stuck to the same formation for the last 2.5 years. 4-2-3-1 it is then, still think we'll be 2nd but that's as long as Maddison stays beyond January. If he doesn't.... 4th?!

 

C+/B

[Ten Caat]

Its a B from me, was a close call nearly a C+ but I'm giving the benefit of the doubt on strength of reaching a cup final, albeit McInnes better buck up his ideas when we play the dhims.

Overall his signings have been above average, O'Connor very very good and Maddison inspired just hope Norwich let us extend to end of season. Morris I kinda get, I think O' Connor was signed to be a defensive midfielder and as such we need central defensive cover but things have worked out differently and wouldnt surprise me to see Morris leave on a free to a Falkirk or similar in January. Storey is a different matter......I presumed he was signed to give us lightning pace up front with the idea of forming a partnership with Rooney. But before it gets a chance to be tried we then go out and get Burns on a loan who seems to me to offer exactly the same qualities as Storey, I am presuming in order to get the loan through Deek has promised Bristol that Burns will feature regularly and thus Storey has been pretty much sidelined and as Stockley offers a differeent option it is who is getting the nod to come off the bench and getting the occasional start.

We now need to take 9 points from our next 3 games to keep pace with sevco who finally seem about to hit a run of form, and who's next 4 matches are all very winnable. Hearts have taken a dip and have a couple of potential banana skins in the same period. Overall I think we will pip sevco for second with Fartz trailing 7-9 point further back in a close fight with the Fermers for 4th

[manc_don]

B- from me.  I know it was only a few games to get to the final, but these are games we could have easily lost had we not been as professional as we have been.  We also beat St. Johnstone who are a bogey team of ours.  I just hope we win the damn thing.

 

However, league wise, it hasn't been great and thats where deek has truly let himself down.  The constant tinkering for tinkering sake at the start of the season was ridiculous.  The continuous picking of McLean is ridiculous. If ever there was a player that needed to be dropped, it was him.  I rate him, but it's just not working out for him at the moment but his price tag is the only reason why he's in the starting XI at the moment.  I think LA hits it on the head, Maddison has absolutely saved our arse.  We better pray we can keep him for the whole duration of the season or I fear the season will wither away.  Finishing below either the newborn huns or diet huns would be unacceptable.

[Stupie82]

I have to agree with Manc, B- for me. I really dont think anyone should be undermining a cup final. I couldn't really care how we got there, or who we beat to get there, as it's completely irrelevant. Some seasons you get difficult teams, other seasons you dont, but what matters is getting there and winning it. If we win it, i wont be thinking we only beat one really good side to win it, i will be thinking its another cup in the cabinet.

 

The league has been the biggest disappointment so far, but its not a disaster... far from it. I said last season that once Rangers got promoted, it would be more difficult and it has been. They are nothing special, but neither are we, however on paper we have the better players and we should be above them. That said, the league season is a long one and there are many games to go and I would expect us to be in 2nd place at the end of the season. If we win the league cup and finish second then its an A-. He only gets an A if he wins the league, which wont happen.

[rocket_scientist]

I really dont think anyone should be undermining a cup final. I couldn't really care how we got there, or who we beat to get there, as it's completely irrelevant. Some seasons you get difficult teams, other seasons you dont, but what matters is getting there and winning it. If we win it, i wont be thinking we only beat one really good side to win it, i will be thinking its another cup in the cabinet.

 

In the context of evaluating the first quarter of the season, nobody is "undermining a cup final".

 

Some of us are just saying that it would be foolish to consider getting there as some sort of great accomplishment. It's the fucking least we could expect given our easy run.

 

You're right, the thing that matters is winning it so again in context of the evaluation parameters, we've not yet.

[DollyLongstaffe]

Unfortunately I think we're close to if not at the glass ceiling we can expect to get to with the budget we've got in the modern game.  Deek has assembled the strongest squad we've had in many years, but compared with the best they are still very limited players.  I doubt we have a single player who'd get a game for Celtic, for example, and they are being quoted at 13/2 tonight against a team that's 11th in the Bundesliga.  It's a sober reminder of where the team that was among the cream of Europe in the early 80s is in the football pecking order now, and that the reason is money, pure and simple.

 

Our extra quality will give us an edge against most of the SPL, over the course of a season, but the differences are too marginal to make the odds much more than 55/45 or 60/40 in a one-off game.  We may have a few quid more than some of our competitors but we're all shopping in the same bargain basement.  We'll win more than we'll lose, and what determines whether we do will be more to do with luck and individual form variations than anything the manager does, although the manager will predictably get it in the neck for every reverse. 

 

We're probably much of a muchness with Hearts and Sevco.  My worry is that Sevco have matched us for points despite a general feeling that they've underperformed while we've delivered closer to expectations.  We also beat them at home but it would be hard to claim we deserved to on the balance of play.  I don't especially fancy our chances against them at Mordor, and I think the balance of probability is they'll finish above us, and however much we rationalise about budgets etc that would be very hard to take.

 

I'd tip us to finish 3rd.  I can't seriously see us winning the league cup final, the gulf in player quality plus virtual home advantage for Celtic and the usual refereeing bias make it a 10-1 shot.

 

In short my gloomy prognosis is we're a limited side, but that is mainly to do with things outside the management's control.  There are areas I'd criticise Deek, but the good - strengthening the squad, retaining our better players, keeping the team motivated, presenting a professional and positive image of the club - far outweigh the bad.  There's more scope for things to get worse than better and in the medium term I'd wager they will, with or without McInnes.  Any significant deterioration from where we are will doubtless see the back of him, but those who think that will lead to improvements on where we are now are deluding themselves in my opinion. 

 

The one thing we haven't had in many years is the kind of player who's obviously destined to play at a higher level coming through our youth system.  I know it's not easy but other SPL clubs have managed it sporadically. 

 

I'd give Deek a B+ for playing a weak hand very shrewdly and solidly if not spectacularly.

[cupidstunt]

C- for reasons stated in the us v tims thread with the addition of we had a shaky start to the season, the results hide it a little but the 0-0 against Hearts and St Johnstone were really poor performances. Could be clear 2nd even with the 2 celtic games.

 

Our transfers have been good but also slightly baffling, Lewis and O'Connor are excellent signings. I'm struggling to see why we signed Morris though when his wage could've went towards an attacking central midfielder and we've signed far too many players for the single strikers role. Burns, Storey and Stockley all in to push Rooney has left us without balance in the squad and still reliant on the creativity of the usual 2, Hayes and McGinn. As we saw against Celtic though when Hayes is marked out the game and McGinn is having a poor game we lose all ability to create and score.

 

 

[Stupie82]

Excellent post Dolly... !!

[manc_don]

Excellent read Dolly 

 

As I said, finishing anywhere but second (yes, first is out) is not acceptable.  We have to finish above a club that doesn't have the budget we do and a club that died and is in turmoil. I'm not calling for him to go if that does happen, but there should be some repercussions and some serious soul searching. It would not be acceptable to many fans imo. 

[LA-Don]

Agree with most of what Dolly is saying but I have to disagree with the last part - I just cannot associate shrewd and spectacular with DM. He's done a very good job of retaining good players like Hayes, Rooney, Logan, and McGinn, but on the field we see too many poor performances - I believe we have the 3rd highest budget behind the old firm but I don't think we get a fair return. As someone else mentioned and I agreed, we peaked about 2 years ago and I question whether he can keep the same players/squad motivated. I think last year DM showed he's limited then he screwed up the winter transfer window. He then had a baffling summer window and left us with an imbalanced squad. The league started poorly and Maddison bailed him out - JM has masked our limited progress or, dare I say, even decline. The January window will be massive for us, especially if/when we lose Maddison. A bad window like last year and I see us struggling to finish above Rangers, Hearts, and maybe even St J. I dread every window too in that we could easily lose Rooney, Logan, Hayes, or McGinn, and I now add O'Connor and Lewis to that list. All will be tough to replace.

 

DM definitely gave us credibility and stability again and we're all happier fighting at this end of the table. However, I do feel we lost the swagger we had, plus you make a huge point - we're not seeing youth coming through and that is a massive concern.

[1903_Redz]

Aye maybe the signs aren't so good without the red tinted specs and that's probably a good reason why the crowds are dropping.

 

I think it may help DMs case if he were to be a bit less loyal to the likes of McLean and McGinn esp. Both are very good footballers on their day but neither are doing the biz at the mo therefore DM should be taking them out. For what it's worth i reckon both of those players are playing out of position, i think BOTH are best suited to the No10 role.

[rocket_scientist]

Agree with most of what Dolly is saying but I have to disagree with the last part - I just cannot associate shrewd and spectacular with DM.

 

That's indisputable and a great point.

 

Much as Dolly is saying is quite obviously obvious about the standards of Scottish football, let's not be a total cunt here.

 

There is fuck all shrewd abut Deek, let alone solid, which you misquoted as spectacular.

 

He's just a weegie wannabe picking up a wage. He's a fucking fud actually in my opinion.

 

It's just not an opinion I've ever expressed before because I know that most would be offended by it.

 

And being popular is SO IMPORTANT to my well-being.

 

[Elgindon]

 

C from me. In order to maintain our(and the players) interest,he's going to have to take more gambles.I think some of the players that have been a bit off form lately is possibly because our approach to games isnt stimulating enough?? Probably vhy the supports a bit meh at pres, despite being in a cup final.

    Trying to change things by personnel, rather than approach to games.Definitely think he can get more out of this squad 

[Madbadteacher]

As an outsider looking in, not being able to get to games etc, I am disappointed. We should be 2nd comfortable 2hd.

 

We should also not be feeling "scared" of a cup final. I remember 1976 and we were huge underdogs but we BELIVED we could win. I think that under DM we lack belief. Hence we are a D+. Some belief and I'd give us a C+ but we are a scared team, and that comes back to Deek.

[BobbyBiscuit]

C.

 

Shinnie to left back.

Considine or McKenna beside O'Connor in the middle of defence.

At least give Storie a chance to show he should be on the bench.

Better quality service to Rooney required.

Stop being utter shite to watch.

[THEBEACHEND]

That's indisputable and a great point.

 

Much as Dolly is saying is quite obviously obvious about the standards of Scottish football, let's not be a total cunt here.

 

There is fuck all shrewd abut Deek, let alone solid, which you misquoted as spectacular.

 

He's just a weegie wannabe picking up a wage. He's a fucking fud actually in my opinion.

 

It's just not an opinion I've ever expressed before because I know that most would be offended by it.

 

And being popular is SO IMPORTANT to my well-being.

 

nailed it. takes some doing to fail in the SPL with a decent budget and no expectations. I believe the regression is upon us, since the split form last season, team needs massively freshened up, a significant number need moved on and I include what others may class as senior, top players. Nobody bar the keeper is irreplaceable in the current side. I give DM a C.