Aberdeen V Motherwell

[A llad insane]

Long 90mns, where t.b.h at times we were 2nd best, at times we play some decent stuff, but far from fluent.

    One great save from Lewis late on , lot of overhit passes & clearances from us all day though.

  Happy with 3 points though as they are a big, powerful, well organised team & hard to beat.

My m.o.t.m was probably G.M.S , McGinn faded out again after a brightish start, great pass through for a well taken goal by Wilson.

Young Anderson missed a sitter 2nd half to kill the game.

Just happy to get the 3 points t.b.h!

[manc_don]

Good news to wake up to  didn't expect it to be a classic in terms of quality, 3 points the most important thing and a goal for Wilson. Happy days

[Jute]

Poor game important 3 points. Agree with Feb 1971 thought Logan was our best player with GMS and McGinn not far behind. I simply don’t get Cosgrove. Not a footballer in any shape or form. Wilson took his goal well but did little else of note. Hopefully more he comes more into things with more game time. We really do create very little though. Defence on the other hand looks rock solid.

[Guest kiriakovisthenewstrachan]

Good three points but we are becoming very pedestrian and predictable, especially when Cosgrove plays. So few real chances being created.

 

Good displays from Shinnie, Logan, GMS and the centre halves. McGinn does not look like the same player we had before he left.

 

Hibs will be difficult. We need to raise it a bit.

 

 

[KennyFuckinPowers]

Struggling to see what Cosgrove could have done any differently to please people? ( Other than score ) He held the ball up well, took a lot of balls into chest and feet and kept it in our possession, flicked plenty of headers on etc... I absolutely agree he has work to do, he's very rough, but he was good when he came on against St Johnstone last week and he was one of the better players today, and for me, he's currently a better option than May. Thankfully he got a very good applause when he was subbed.

 

Like May, he's not going to suit a lone Striker role, but he's more useful and more of a handful, than May.

 

Fwiw, I thought Anderson didn't do himself any favours again when he came on, he had 2 good opportunities and ballooned the first effort and was too slow to get a shot away at his second effort. A positive there though, he's getting into good positions, just very raw with age ( Probably the same as Cosgrove )

[BobbyBiscuit]

Great to get the win, much needed.

 

I thought Logan did very well against Sammon; they clearly targeted Logan as the smallest defender and hit that diagonal ball throughout the game towards Sammon, and apart from the first tussle i think Logan won them all.  Good on him, because we've been bullied by them in the past with tactics like that and he stood strong.

 

Great finish by Wilson, but that was a superb pass from McGinn. There aren't many players in our team who would have executed that properly, or even seen it. The last two goals we've scored have been down to his talent and vision, it would be lovely if fans could stop screaming abuse at him.  Considering how precious some are about the criticisms the manager gets, it's incredible that McGinn doesn't get more support.  The guy has won us a ridiculous number of points over the last five years.

 

And, fair play to McInnes today - would have been easy for him to play certain players today, but he put on young Dean Campbell when he could have put on Gleeson or Forrester. And he could have put on May but he put on Anderson.  I think the boss was making a couple of statements today, even if it's just to waken those guys up, but that's what's needed. it's timely too, this is a massive week for us, and I think we can go into Tuesday in a bit more confidence.

 

Long way to go but today was needed, hope we kick on from here.

[Lencarl]

The win was the most important thing yesterday. May was not missed. Wilson did what he is here to do after 5 minutes. The most frustrating thing about Aberdeen is that some players hold on to the ball far to long in the final half of the pitch and eventually the attack breaks down. McGinn is like that, does okay in the build up and then try's to take on to many opposition players before losing the ball.

 

They will need to play better on Tuesday to get through the tie against Hibs.

[RicoS321]

And, fair play to McInnes today - would have been easy for him to play certain players today, but he put on young Dean Campbell when he could have put on Gleeson or Forrester. And he could have put on May but he put on Anderson.  I think the boss was making a couple of statements today, even if it's just to waken those guys up, but that's what's needed. it's timely too, this is a massive week for us, and I think we can go into Tuesday in a bit more confidence.

 

Long way to go but today was needed, hope we kick on from here.

 

^^^Exactly this.

[rocket_scientist]

If McInnes is getting lauded for playing youth and for "making a statement" to the experienced campaigners yesterday, aren't we going to scratch our heads and wonder why it's taken FIVE FUCKING YEARS for him to finally do one aspect of his job properly? He's been way too loyal to underperforming journeymen that he recruited. Has he changed? Has he finally woken up? Does he now know that it's not been working? Has he suddenly developed a will to win at all costs and become a risk-taker overnight?

 

These are not criticisms of the manager nor is this post worthy of the unjustified criticism (that some like to repeat) that all Aberdonians are negative moaning cunts. I'm simply asking one very simple question. Why now?

 

The timing is very interesting.

[RicoS321]

If McInnes is getting lauded for playing youth and for "making a statement" to the experienced campaigners yesterday, aren't we going to scratch our heads and wonder why it's taken FIVE FUCKING YEARS for him to finally do one aspect of his job properly? He's been way too loyal to underperforming journeymen that he recruited. Has he changed? Has he finally woken up? Does he now know that it's not been working? Has he suddenly developed a will to win at all costs and become a risk-taker overnight?

 

These are not criticisms of the manager nor is this post worthy of the unjustified criticism (that some like to repeat) that all Aberdonians are negative moaning cunts. I'm simply asking one very simple question. Why now?

 

The timing is very interesting.

 

Who knows, perhaps it's as simple as the youths we've got being better? Campbell looks a very decent prospect (better than Fyvie - pre-injury - did when he first emerged) and Anderson also seems better than any young striker we've had in a good number of years. Maybe we've taken our signings to a whole new level of shiteness? Honestly, I think it's the former. Take Frank Ross as an example. In my opinion he's been marginally better than Forrester this season and so should have been on the bench instead on Saturday. However, I don't think Ross is going to be good enough for us in the long run (I'd put him in the Cammy Smith bracket just now, but happy to be proven wrong) so I don't think he's forcing Deek's hand on the issue, which is what seems to have happened in years gone by - including with Wright. I think that both Campbell vs Gleeson and Anderson vs May is a pretty close contest with the youngsters proving more dynamic and more of a threat despite having a long way to go. We saw both their limitations at the weekend and these are things that have been ironed out of the more experienced players, with the obvious difference of one being at the peak of their potential and the other a youngster with a lot of room for improvement. When I look at Anderson and Campbell, I see a large area that they can both grow into with their existing attributes. I think that they can both get a lot better. I don't see that in Ross and I didn't see it in Smith or Shankland (much as I'd love to).

 

That said, I think Saturday was a one off to make a point. We'll need guys like May and Gleeson, and Campbell and Anderson aren't going to be reliable enough for a full season, so I expect we'll revert to type having made the point now. Which is a shame.

[rocket_scientist]

Who knows, perhaps it's as simple as the youths we've got being better?

 

so I expect we'll revert to type having made the point now. Which is a shame.

 

Whatever the merits of this youngster or that one, I think we mostly all agree that one of his faults is being overly loyal to underperforming players at the expense of developing youth. Every human has strengths and weaknesses. That's just one aspect of his management that's been very poor. This is a symptom of his personality of course and probably of his history too.

 

In my opinion he was forced to bench May by public opinion. The fans had never booed him before and when he got subbed off at McDiarmid, this would've got McInnes to reflect and re-assess. Going into Saturday's match, there was only one team in the SPFL with less wins that our solitary one in five. It had been a terrible points haul and with Hibs and Celtic coming up, games that could go a long way to defining the season, the opportunity v. Motherwell was now or never to do the right thing, to drop the donkeys and blood more youth and hunger.

 

Unfortunately I think you're right and that he will revert to type tomorrow and if May does have a rare good game, he'll think that dropping him for one match was a managerial masterstroke, thereby allowing him to deny the reality that he either recruited a dud or is failing to get the best out of him. Same for Gleeson and Forrester. The personality trait behind all this is obstinance. Just like he refuses to play Shinnie at LB, McInnes will continue to flog dead horses in the hope that he will be proved right in the longer term. He will not face up to the fact that it's been his shite recruitment in midfield that has led to Shinnie trying to paper over his cracks. I hope his "making statements" has the desired effect but I suspect the experienced footballers he's recruited are not good enough on one hand or he's not a good enough manager to work their bollocks off on the other, in order to get winning performances out of them.

[BobbyBiscuit]

Who knows, perhaps it's as simple as the youths we've got being better? Campbell looks a very decent prospect (better than Fyvie - pre-injury - did when he first emerged)

 

Not seen nearly enough of Campbell to say that in my opinion. Fyvie controlled the midfield at Ibrox in one of his early games (a 0-0, I think), Campbell hasn't had nearly enough game time to be compared to when Fyvie came through.

[Ten Caat]

 

 

Seen quite a bit of Campbell on Red Tv playing for the reserves and in my opinion he is the best of the youngsters coming through. As I've said elsewhere, i think he will get a decent amount of time coming on as a second half sub before Xmas with a few starts in "easier" games and should be ready by Easter to push for a regular start ahead of Gleeson/Ball......lets face it he doesn't have to be a world beater to get in ahead of either of them.

 

Rico mentioned about Frank Ross not being on the bench ahead of Forrester against 'Well. I could be mistaken but I thought he was out injured and has been for a few weeks?

[Ramperbamper]

To be fair, Ferguson is as accomplished young player as I've seen for us for a long time (bar McKenna), McInnes gave him the opportunity and has kept him in the team ahead of Forrester despite numerous opportunities for him not to.

 

Campbell has promise but probably needs to grow physically before he can become a constant in the midfield. Anderson has done well but doesn't appear to be a lone striker (suspect you play one of him or Wilson together with one of May or Cosgrove), Wright looked very good when played against St Mirren before his injury so it looks like his time is now, and I've not seen enough of Ross to comment but he certainly looks keen and hungry.

[RicoS321]

Not seen nearly enough of Campbell to say that in my opinion. Fyvie controlled the midfield at Ibrox in one of his early games (a 0-0, I think), Campbell hasn't had nearly enough game time to be compared to when Fyvie came through.

 

Seen quite a bit of Campbell on Red Tv playing for the reserves and in my opinion he is the best of the youngsters coming through. As I've said elsewhere, i think he will get a decent amount of time coming on as a second half sub before Xmas with a few starts in "easier" games and should be ready by Easter to push for a regular start ahead of Gleeson/Ball......lets face it he doesn't have to be a world beater to get in ahead of either of them.

 

Rico mentioned about Frank Ross not being on the bench ahead of Forrester against 'Well. I could be mistaken but I thought he was out injured and has been for a few weeks?

 

Yep, seems he wasn't on the bench for St Johstone either (but was for Killie) so yer probably right. Agree with Bobby that we haven't seen enough of Campbell, I was just bigging him up and making an early call as I think he'll turn out as good as Jack/Fyvie(pre-injury)/Ferguson in the coming years. He seems to have that balance, comfort on the ball but a little extra height too (compared with Fyvie).

 

Ramper - in terms of Ferguson, I think McInnes has always sided with signed youth over brought through. Really it was Hamilton that gave him his chance rather than McInnes and he was signed as a first team squad member rather than reserves. He seems to have that implicit trust of bought-in youth (see Christie, Maddison, Nwakali etc - players that are around the same age as our own youngsters) that he doesn't afford our brought through youth. That could just be because he sees/has seen more of our own players, but who knows.

[wee toon red]

I think the point about our youngsters perhaps being better now than those we've had previously is a very good one. Whether that's in relation to the general standard of the squad or to previous generations remains to be seen.

 

The lack of any of our recent unwanted youths going on to any success elsewhere would certainly point to the majority of them having been shite and does, to a certain extent, justify mcinnes' decision not to give them game time.

[RicoS321]

I think the point about our youngsters perhaps being better now than those we've had previously is a very good one. Whether that's in relation to the general standard of the squad or to previous generations remains to be seen.

 

The lack of any of our recent unwanted youths going on to any success elsewhere would certainly point to the majority of them having been shite and does, to a certain extent, justify mcinnes' decision not to give them game time.

 

It is a good point (I made it, so it must be), but it ignores some critical thinking. I think everyone agrees that Campbell shouldn't replace Shinnie, or wouldn't have replaced McLean or whoever. They are there to bulk up the squad in the same manner as their replacements (yer Gleesons, yer Storeys and so on). Are we not only failing to improve our young players, but also wasting funds? Whilst Cammy Smith hasn't gone on to bigger and better things, he's still better than Tansey, Storey and so on. Similarly Joe Shug has been a significantly greater success than many of the other horses we've taken in and given game time to (Alan Tate, arguably O'Connor and Taylor, Morris etc). Perhaps we're busy searching for the next Eoin Jess, when a steady squad player would save the massive redundancy of many of our shite signings. Whilst it might seem a little underwhelming, Shankland (and definitely Magennis) would have been better than Storey, Maynard, Parker, probably Stockley and others and would have saved a tonne on poor recruitment. Recruitment that often seems to be done as an end in itself rather than as a strategic development process. Could we have just cut out a massive chunk of our recruitment for various positions and concentrated on one or two absolutely key positions each year? I think that looking how the youth players who didn't go on to better things vs non-youth players who also didn't go on to better things, I think we'd be no worse off. I think we're ignoring the latter category.

[Elgindon]

 

Too early to rule anyone out yet,even Stevie May(hasnt been tried enough in a front 2),.....or Forrester for that matter  til we get the semblance of our strongest squad playing over a number of games

  Gleeson and Forrester looked reasonable additions at the time,but look like they could be the weak link in the side.Think they both need a manager that can get into their heads,which I think is one of Del's weaker areas of management IMO.

    Maybe need to source someone more authoritative in January for midfield

[TheDeeDon]

Too early to rule anyone out yet,even Stevie May(hasnt been tried enough in a front 2),.....or Forrester for that matter  til we get the semblance of our strongest squad playing over a number of games

  Gleeson and Forrester looked reasonable additions at the time,but look like they could be the weak link in the side.Think they both need a manager that can get into their heads,which I think is one of Del's weaker areas of management IMO.

    Maybe need to source someone more authoritative in January for midfield

 

I would have to agree that he needs to get another midfielder in during the January window if he cannot get more from Gleeson before that time. I don't fancy going the next few months with just Shinnie and Ball in the middle.

 

I thought we were shyte on Saturday, not as bad as the Killie game, but shyte nonetheless. I ken, we got 3 points and a clean sheet, but it was torture on the eyes.  Motherwell are brutal, not much footballing ability in that side whatsoever, but we shouldn't have to match teams like that to get points.

 

 

[Ten Caat]

 

Motherwell are brutal, not much footballing ability

 

There was only one team trying to play football the correct way on Saturday. And it wasnt us....