Season 2019/2020 Rebuilding

[LA-Don]

Good news. Solid player who can do a job more often than not. Unlikely to be anyone’s first choice, even at centre half, but can’t be faulted for effort and commitment to the club so a more than decent squad player.

 

Sorry, disagree. The love affair with Considine is clouding judgement. 32 and getting slower and gets a 2 year deal with a 3rd year option? Geez. At fault regularly for goals, what will a 33-35 year old Andy look like, running in quick sand? I have to believe there is someone better out there for similar money with an upside/potential,and if he's a so called squad player get someone younger to do the back up job.

 

This is a lazy signing. What next, Bruce Anderson and Scott Wright being 'new signings.' We're in this mess, the biggest rebuild yet, because DM has failed in the market to adequately replace the better players when they left.

[Ten Caat]

Yet he's keeping Devlin out the side right now (on merit) and as we all know Devlin got a Scotland call up earlier in the season.

 

2 years is fine. Next season he will revert to being a squad player....he won't play left back again unless in dire emergency. He was never quick anyway but his experience means he can read situations and will be absolutely solid enough when required against your St Johnstone's etc.

[manc_don]

Happy enough for him to be a squad player and whilst I get where you're coming from LA, we have so much work to do this summer that having a known entity (as back up) is a good option to have.  Certainly no love affair from me, but he's deserving of a new deal.

[TheDeeDon]

I have no issue with Considine staying and what appears to be seeing out his career with us. He is dependable for the most part and hardly ever lets you down, yes he makes errors, but is dependable enough for us in the majority of our games, but please don't play him at left back.

 

You let him go and who do we replace him with? He is a far better player than either Ash Taylor or Anthony O'Connor were for us, so I'd rather have one of our own in the squad than another English lower league donkey.

[DantheDon]

I agree that considine can do a job at center back if needed. Preferably as a back up but like others have said with the difficulty in recruiting players of the quality we would like i think its always good to have a known quantity.

 

On another note has anyone heard any updates on the training facilities? Are they going to be ready for the new season? Ive not heard anything recently and ive never known a construction project that was in on time.

[Tzetanov]

Probably the most important transfer window in DMs time here.  I would like to think targets have been identified and offers have been made to a few players.  Maybe DM is holding off a bit to see if there is any additional budget from potential sale if Fraser and McKenna.  Quite possible that we get a few quid from McLean getting promoted yesterday.

A few hearts fans saying we have spoke to Djoum.. I believe we have also offered Cadden at Motherwell but he is hoping to move south.  As for the training ground , it won’t be ready for preseason.  Late September at best it will be completed. 

[KennyFuckinPowers]

Greg Stewart has apparently agreed to join Rangers on a 3-year contract, don't think anyone will be surprised to hear that. Disappointed it never worked out for him here, everyone can draw their own conclusions as to why that is, be it that he's not actually that good or McInnes didn't get the best from him.

 

Joe Shaughnessy was left left out of St Johnstone's squad yesterday as Tommy Wright has confirmed he's rejected a new contract, I wonder if he's coming back here? Might have other offers on the table so we'll see how that one pans out.

 

And another name now being mentioned is Arnoud Djoum, Hearts fans on Social Media seem to know something we don't and are convinced he's coming here. 

[Ten Caat]

Shaughnessy I don't think is happening....reckons he can get better money down south. Probably correct notwithstanding that it will be at an EFL1 club at best.

 

Delighted that Stewart is joining sevco, for 10k/week if reports are true. They'll find out just how shite he is fairly sharpish and I'll predict that he will hardly ever get selected after his first 6 months there. Eventually sevco will punt him on loan (probably to Killie, sevco covering around 80% of his wages) as, just like his time with Birmingham, they won't be able to give him away on a free transfer as he will be on such a ridiculously high wage for a an utter dud.

 

Djoum…..yeah Jambo's seem certain he's on his way here. Guessing he's the Shinnie replacement. Decent enough player but assuming Ball also signs on that's going to leave us with 4 defensive midfielders ( Campbell and Gleeson being the other 2) vying for 2 starting places at best. Don't want to see Campbell's game time severely restricted.....I don't think he's quite ready to be a first choice for at least the first half of next season but absolutely should be by next summer and possibly a wee bit earlier.

[manc_don]

Probably the most important transfer window in DMs time here.  I would like to think targets have been identified and offers have been made to a few players.  Maybe DM is holding off a bit to see if there is any additional budget from potential sale if Fraser and McKenna.  Quite possible that we get a few quid from McLean getting promoted yesterday.

A few hearts fans saying we have spoke to Djoum.. I believe we have also offered Cadden at Motherwell but he is hoping to move south.  As for the training ground , it won’t be ready for preseason.  Late September at best it will be completed.

 

Welcome aboard 

[TheDeeDon]

I think the onus has to be on bringing in quality this summer and forget about quantity. We are lacking quality in almost every area of the park, but finding the said quality required is going to be bloody difficult.

 

I actually think we will have to rely more on our own kids from now on than trying to bring in established names who can improve us, which will be nigh on impossible given our budget constraints.

 

I think one of the best things we could do this summer is get Lewis signed up on a new deal as I hate to think how bad we would have been this season if it wasn't for him.

[RicoS321]

I think the onus has to be on bringing in quality this summer and forget about quantity. We are lacking quality in almost every area of the park, but finding the said quality required is going to be bloody difficult.

 

I actually think we will have to rely more on our own kids from now on than trying to bring in established names who can improve us, which will be nigh on impossible given our budget constraints.

 

I think one of the best things we could do this summer is get Lewis signed up on a new deal as I hate to think how bad we would have been this season if it wasn't for him.

 

The problem is, is that is what we tried to do last summer. We got a few key signings in as first teamers. We then spent the end of the window adding Lowe, Hobban, Wilson, Ball to make up for the fact that our initial signings were pap. We've ended up with a lightweight squad which wouldn't have been the case. We'd have been completely fine if Forrester, Gleeson and Wilson hadn't been shite. We've ended up with a squad with a host of extras who all need game time at some stage to keep them happy, but if Gleeson and Forrester had been up to it then Ball wouldn't have been signed. If we'd got Lowe in earlier, then Hobban wouldn't have been signed. If May and Cosgrove hadn't been average then Wilson wouldn't have been signed.

 

The problem that we have is that we're looking for so many first teamers we'll inevitably get a good few dross purchases at the same time - it's the nature of the business unfortunately. Given the turnover again, I think we'll struggle to retain a light squad without being completely ruthless.

 

For example, I'd happily have Cosgrove, Anderson and another striker up front but we'd have to ditch May. In the front 3 McLennan, Wright, McGinn and GMS replacement might again be enough. I'd happily have Ferguson, Shinnie replacement (Djoum), Campbell, New Signing in midfield but that would mean getting rid of both Gleeson and Ball. In defence we've only really got Harrington as cover for right back coming through, so Lowe (or Lowe replacement), plus Considine, McKenna, Devlin and Logan would seem exceptionally light so I'd get a Hobban type signing too.

 

That is a minimum of 6 signings right there. Are you realistic about our ability to make 6 accurate signings in the summer window? I would think that we'd have to make ten signings in order to get 6 good ones (by good, I mean two midfielders that are better than Ball for example). That's going to leave us with an additional 4 players who we'll have on the bench fighting for time with the youngsters. Even that would/should be deemed a succesful window with a 60% success rate on signings.

 

It certainly highlights the stupidity of those suggesting we get rid of Considine.

[ayrshire_don74]

tbf consi has been pretty solid at cb with devlins drop in form he has been required, is sam roscoe any use ?

[RicoS321]

tbf consi has been pretty solid at cb with devlins drop in form he has been required, is sam roscoe any use ?

 

I haven't heard how is Alloa stint is going. He missed a chunk of their games in the last month or two. Hopefully it was injury, rather than ability, related. Played every game up until March. Happy to have him as back up like if he's good enough.

[KennyFuckinPowers]

There's no doubt that this is his biggest test, signing wise, so far, and whilst the likes of Hearts & Motherwell are preparing for next season having added a few pre-contracts, there's nothing to suggest that we haven't tried to either. We lost out on Jordan Jones this time last year I believe, McInnes has openly admitted that now, we lost out on some Barcelona " B " Striker a year or two ago as well, McInnes having also admitted that, Jason Scotland another one and I am pretty sure there will be more.

 

The likes of Djoum & Shaughnessy are steady SPFL players, nothing more, nothing less, they at least know the league, know the " expectation " and they are within our wage budget. But even if they did sign, we're still a fair chunk of players missing to piece together that jigsaw.

 

We absolutely must sign a permanent Left Back, in the mould of Lowe, as well as a creative midfielder ( a Maddison or a McLean ) within our means of course, because that position has affected us a lot this season.

[Jute]

I haven't heard how is Alloa stint is going. He missed a chunk of their games in the last month or two. Hopefully it was injury, rather than ability, related. Played every game up until March. Happy to have him as back up like if he's good enough.

 

Sure I saw something about him having a hamstring injury recently.

[Guest kiriakovisthenewstrachan]

There's no doubt that this is his biggest test, signing wise, so far, and whilst the likes of Hearts & Motherwell are preparing for next season having added a few pre-contracts, there's nothing to suggest that we haven't tried to either. We lost out on Jordan Jones this time last year I believe, McInnes has openly admitted that now, we lost out on some Barcelona " B " Striker a year or two ago as well, McInnes having also admitted that, Jason Scotland another one and I am pretty sure there will be more.

 

The likes of Djoum & Shaughnessy are steady SPFL players, nothing more, nothing less, they at least know the league, know the " expectation " and they are within our wage budget. But even if they did sign, we're still a fair chunk of players missing to piece together that jigsaw.

 

We absolutely must sign a permanent Left Back, in the mould of Lowe, as well as a creative midfielder ( a Maddison or a McLean ) within our means of course, because that position has affected us a lot this season.

 

Your last point just underlines how difficult it is to get quality in at virtually no cost KP.  Maddison went for £20m just a few months back and McLean would likely be worth a couple of million in todays market. DM is almost a victim of his own success with these players in that the fans will expect replacements of the same quality when we are shopping in the free/loan market. A hard job by anyone's standards. We do certainly need some creativity and goals from the middle of the park next season.

[A llad insane]

Badly in need of midfielders  2 or mabye even 3, dont think Campbell is quite ready yet for a start ( but he will) Hoping & praying we somehow manage to get Lowe on loan again , & also hoping Hoban returns to fitness & to us.

    Width badly needed in team , especially if G.M.S goes, which looks likely, McLennan is very hot & cold just now, nobody should be a stick on starter every week, regardless of form.

New striker required.

[TheDeeDon]

The problem is, is that is what we tried to do last summer. We got a few key signings in as first teamers. We then spent the end of the window adding Lowe, Hobban, Wilson, Ball to make up for the fact that our initial signings were pap. We've ended up with a lightweight squad which wouldn't have been the case. We'd have been completely fine if Forrester, Gleeson and Wilson hadn't been shite. We've ended up with a squad with a host of extras who all need game time at some stage to keep them happy, but if Gleeson and Forrester had been up to it then Ball wouldn't have been signed. If we'd got Lowe in earlier, then Hobban wouldn't have been signed. If May and Cosgrove hadn't been average then Wilson wouldn't have been signed.

 

The problem that we have is that we're looking for so many first teamers we'll inevitably get a good few dross purchases at the same time - it's the nature of the business unfortunately. Given the turnover again, I think we'll struggle to retain a light squad without being completely ruthless.

 

For example, I'd happily have Cosgrove, Anderson and another striker up front but we'd have to ditch May. In the front 3 McLennan, Wright, McGinn and GMS replacement might again be enough. I'd happily have Ferguson, Shinnie replacement (Djoum), Campbell, New Signing in midfield but that would mean getting rid of both Gleeson and Ball. In defence we've only really got Harrington as cover for right back coming through, so Lowe (or Lowe replacement), plus Considine, McKenna, Devlin and Logan would seem exceptionally light so I'd get a Hobban type signing too.

 

That is a minimum of 6 signings right there. Are you realistic about our ability to make 6 accurate signings in the summer window? I would think that we'd have to make ten signings in order to get 6 good ones (by good, I mean two midfielders that are better than Ball for example). That's going to leave us with an additional 4 players who we'll have on the bench fighting for time with the youngsters. Even that would/should be deemed a succesful window with a 60% success rate on signings.

 

It certainly highlights the stupidity of those suggesting we get rid of Considine.

 

Like my post says I am looking to see us bring in quality, so we should try and bring in a couple of players who will improve us and make a difference to the team and ensuring we have done proper checks on the players and their characters. If we could make 2-3 quality signings then we worry about the other shyte we sign to make up the numbers which will happen, but we do need to bring in some sort of quality to the team, a midfielder is a must, but easier said than done, especially with our last few windows not being the best and our budget constraints.

 

I'm happy we are keeping Considine, as he is reliable for the most part and I think most other clubs would be happy to have him in their squad. Also hoping to see the continuing progress of our own youngsters coming through as that is the future for us.

 

It should be an interesting summer though.

[manc_don]

I don't think 2-3 high quality signings will be enough. We need 2-3 midfielders alone.  Whilst youth is great, we've seen how hot and cold they can be, especially this season.  Obviously the only way to develop them is play them, but we need good experience to guide them and pick up the times when they're not performing.

 

Jambo's certainly seem to be mixed about his presumed departure. Some saying he's not been the player he was, others annoyed he's potentially going to us.  Guessing it's somewhere in between, but he looks decent enough.

 

Milne needs to back DM, but I really don't know if I trust him.  We really need to get players that can find a style of play again, fuck knows what it is now. It's been woeful football for a good year or two now.

[TheDeeDon]

I don't think 2-3 high quality signings will be enough. We need 2-3 midfielders alone.  Whilst youth is great, we've seen how hot and cold they can be, especially this season.  Obviously the only way to develop them is play them, but we need good experience to guide them and pick up the times when they're not performing.

 

Jambo's certainly seem to be mixed about his presumed departure. Some saying he's not been the player he was, others annoyed he's potentially going to us.  Guessing it's somewhere in between, but he looks decent enough.

 

Milne needs to back DM, but I really don't know if I trust him.  We really need to get players that can find a style of play again, fuck knows what it is now. It's been woeful football for a good year or two now.

 

We do need more than 2 or 3 quality signings, but realistically we are not going to get the numbers in that we require quality wise, so be prepared for more dross to sign to make up the numbers. The kids may blow hot and cold but I'd rather see a young lad get a chance than another journeyman from England in making up the numbers.  At the moment we are playing catch up with our squad due to poor signings in the previous windows. It doesn't matter who the manager is, any manager would struggle to find the quality we require with the budget we have.

 

For me we are a little stale and we need something to keep the momentum of the previous few seasons going, whether that will be a new manager or not I have no idea, but another season like this one is not an exiting prospect.

[RicoS321]

We do need more than 2 or 3 quality signings, but realistically we are not going to get the numbers in that we require quality wise, so be prepared for more dross to sign to make up the numbers. The kids may blow hot and cold but I'd rather see a young lad get a chance than another journeyman from England in making up the numbers.  At the moment we are playing catch up with our squad due to poor signings in the previous windows. It doesn't matter who the manager is, any manager would struggle to find the quality we require with the budget we have.

 

For me we are a little stale and we need something to keep the momentum of the previous few seasons going, whether that will be a new manager or not I have no idea, but another season like this one is not an exiting prospect.

 

The problem is that the dross is not the "making up the numbers" element of our squad. The dross are the guys that were bought in to be the first team (the high quality signings). Ball, Considine and Cosgrove should have been our dross this season, but they are first team regulars, each with over 30 games this season.

 

We simply cannot say "we need 2-3 high quality signings" because the return on player signings in this league is/should be about 50%. In reality, we need 5-6 high quality signings in the hope that 2-3 make it.

 

We could significantly reduce our risk by signing Max Lowe for example. Signing Djoum is low risk (although I think he's worse than Shinnie, but still pretty decent) but you'd still want another midfielder beyond him. Cadden would be an excellent signing. Stealing McNulty from Hibs would be an excellent piece of business too. The point being that your high quality signings are players that we will already know about. That then comes with a wage bill by paying Djoum more than Hertz, or an even bigger wage bill by getting Cadden or McNulty before a wealthier English club comes in. Are there any other players you can think of in that bracket? If it's not this type of low risk tried and tested player then we're back to a 50% strike rate and the dross building up. As you say, we're way behind after 2 poor summer windows in a row, so we're roughly where we were when McInnes started, which I don't suppose is unusual in fitba. I'd be inclined just to ditch May, Gleeson and Ball in the summer and really just go full scale re-build.

[KennyFuckinPowers]

The problem is that the dross is not the "making up the numbers" element of our squad. The dross are the guys that were bought in to be the first team (the high quality signings). Ball, Considine and Cosgrove should have been our dross this season, but they are first team regulars, each with over 30 games this season.

 

We simply cannot say "we need 2-3 high quality signings" because the return on player signings in this league is/should be about 50%. In reality, we need 5-6 high quality signings in the hope that 2-3 make it.

 

We could significantly reduce our risk by signing Max Lowe for example. Signing Djoum is low risk (although I think he's worse than Shinnie, but still pretty decent) but you'd still want another midfielder beyond him. Cadden would be an excellent signing. Stealing McNulty from Hibs would be an excellent piece of business too. The point being that your high quality signings are players that we will already know about. That then comes with a wage bill by paying Djoum more than Hertz, or an even bigger wage bill by getting Cadden or McNulty before a wealthier English club comes in. Are there any other players you can think of in that bracket? If it's not this type of low risk tried and tested player then we're back to a 50% strike rate and the dross building up. As you say, we're way behind after 2 poor summer windows in a row, so we're roughly where we were when McInnes started, which I don't suppose is unusual in fitba. I'd be inclined just to ditch May, Gleeson and Ball in the summer and really just go full scale re-build.

 

Good shout. Heckingbottom plays 2 Strikers, or at least he has done since taking over at Hibs, Kamberi & McNulty, and I have watched them on BT Sport at least 3 times, they play Football, they don't punt it long and they don't panic in possession, they get the ball in to their Strikers from the ground and it looks good on the eye and they have had success from it. No idea if that's a sustainable style but for the moment, they're doing well.

 

Cosgrove is probably more comfortable when the ball is played to him on the ground, he is constantly fighting a losing battle with the style of Football we're playing at the moment. But McNulty would be a perfect partner for him, based on what I have seen, and I very much agree that it would be an excellent piece of business.

[Ten Caat]

McNulty only on loan at Hibs (From Coventry??). Agree if we could get him on board it would be a great bit of business. Doubt they'd be too difficult to deal with and surely we could offer him a better package than Hibs.

[RicoS321]

McNulty only on loan at Hibs (From Coventry??). Agree if we could get him on board it would be a great bit of business. Doubt they'd be too difficult to deal with and surely we could offer him a better package than Hibs.

 

Is it not Reading? Anyway, I think we're very close to Hibs in average wages all things considered. We could certainly offer a better package, but not a significantly better package. That type of offering can then easily be watered down by preferred location, knowing the club and players and so on. In other words, I don't think we could offer enough of a financial incentive if he's enjoying life in Edinburgh or loves working for Cuntingbottom or whatever.

[Jute]

Is it not Reading? Anyway, I think we're very close to Hibs in average wages all things considered. We could certainly offer a better package, but not a significantly better package. That type of offering can then easily be watered down by preferred location, knowing the club and players and so on. In other words, I don't think we could offer enough of a financial incentive if he's enjoying life in Edinburgh or loves working for Cuntingbottom or whatever.

 

He is an Edinburgh lad so back home which is important to him allegedly. Suspect we would have to seriously beat Hibs wage offer to have any chance of getting him in. Would expect clubs in league 1 in England would still be interested in his services as well.