McInnes must go

[ayrshire_don74]

13 minutes ago, Panda said:

Goodwin? Bit difficult since they got knocked out in the semis.

st something lol 

[RedStarTorphins]

1 hour ago, Panda said:

 

We do this all the time, tip guys for the job after they get a few good results. Stephen Robinson used to be regularly tipped for the Aberdeen job, Jack Ross was the man when he was at St Mirren, Tommy Wright after he won the Scottish Cup. I even remember when John Hughes was perfect for Aberdeen. It won't be long before David Martindale is the front runner. 

So Jim Goodwin is the latest one, because at clubs like St Mirren you only remember the good results and not the poor ones, ie that before these past two games they had won once in seven games, or that they're one or two defeats away from a relegation fight. 

He's doing okay. But lets wait until he's been in the job more than five minutes. 

Aye, there’s so many “flavour of the month” shouts from fans.

We need a change... but it’s not going to happen any time soon.

We’re skint & can’t afford it 

[RicoS321]

1 hour ago, LA-Don said:

Curious for people’s thoughts. McInnes has been with us almost 8 years now, what would you say is a Mcinnes team? What style and attributes has he brought us that has stuck, when we watch us play, what is a mcinnes team? What has he stamped on us, passing team, creative flair, hard as nails, disciplined?? Personally, I think fuck all which says a lot...

No it doesn't say a lot. What style did fergie have? The winning one. If McInnes had a single style in 8 years, we'd have been worked out by every other team. Our points totals always suggest otherwise. Strange you mention disciplined, I'd say we're extremely disciplined to a man. We're brilliant at closing out victories and we rarely hear of any off field misdemeanour (a sober Soul visit the pinnacle for these boring cunts). Professionalism is a definite plus factor. We're night and day as a club since pre-McInnes, when we were just a shoddy mess. McInnes' flaws are generally tactical and in player recruitment. They've been done to death. 

[Elgindon]

Cant argue with that ^^,though i'd have had him gone a couple of seasons ago because most of us were tired of the same old.If we can get a settled side (for more than a week),and get back to a semblance of the early season fitba,I'd be happy to let him carry on to the end of the season and review things then,though i'd be looking for far more of a response to Celtics woes between now and then

   

Edited January 30, 2021 by Elgindon

[LA-Don]

2 hours ago, RicoS321 said:

No it doesn't say a lot. What style did fergie have? The winning one. If McInnes had a single style in 8 years, we'd have been worked out by every other team. Our points totals always suggest otherwise. Strange you mention disciplined, I'd say we're extremely disciplined to a man. We're brilliant at closing out victories and we rarely hear of any off field misdemeanour (a sober Soul visit the pinnacle for these boring cunts). Professionalism is a definite plus factor. We're night and day as a club since pre-McInnes, when we were just a shoddy mess. McInnes' flaws are generally tactical and in player recruitment. They've been done to death. 

It says a lot, there are plenty of teams who have a style/philosophy on the park and that doesn’t mean the they get shut down. Many clubs have a culture and a style of play, arsenal, man United, Liverpool, Barcelona etc. but it doesn’t have to be a top team, or make us predictable and easy to be worked out. We could be a team known for our passing, building from the back or through our midfield, our work rate, our attacking full backs, our wing play, our creativity with set plays, our toughness, our chip on the shoulder attitude like Ferguson’s Aberdeen. What’s our identity on the park? Teams even take on their managers personality. I feel we really lack drive, determination, leadership, and direction on the park right now. 

You are correct, I’ve heard we’re more professional under mcinnes but what has that got or won us? What has disciplined won us? He needs to be a better coach, or the rest doesn’t mean much. We are regularly boring, a bit soft, predictable, and seem to struggle for ideas or a plan B. You are also correct, Ferguson’s team had a winning mentality, but I’d argue, if anything, we have a losers mentality when you see us play Celtic or rangers and that comes from the manager and his methods/approach. That’s hard to lose once you have it.

You say we are brilliant at closing out victories? Are we? Or do you mean his very negative, conservative, and extremely frustrating game management? Especially against the majority of teams in our league, sitting back and holding on for victory isn’t really necessary with the ability we have. I feel he takes it to extremes and we maybe scrape and hold on for a 2-1 win when it could and should have been 4 or 5 and he develop a killer instinct or bully mentality. 

I guess I answer my own question here but his style is more negative than positive to me now. It got us ‘success’ when rangers, hearts, hibs, Dundee United etc were all fucked financially and terrible, but what now?

[RicoS321]

1 hour ago, LA-Don said:

It says a lot, there are plenty of teams who have a style/philosophy on the park and that doesn’t mean the they get shut down. Many clubs have a culture and a style of play, arsenal, man United, Liverpool, Barcelona etc. but it doesn’t have to be a top team, or make us predictable and easy to be worked out. We could be a team known for our passing, building from the back or through our midfield, our work rate, our attacking full backs, our wing play, our creativity with set plays, our toughness, our chip on the shoulder attitude like Ferguson’s Aberdeen. What’s our identity on the park? Teams even take on their managers personality. I feel we really lack drive, determination, leadership, and direction on the park right now. 

You are correct, I’ve heard we’re more professional under mcinnes but what has that got or won us? What has disciplined won us? He needs to be a better coach, or the rest doesn’t mean much. We are regularly boring, a bit soft, predictable, and seem to struggle for ideas or a plan B. You are also correct, Ferguson’s team had a winning mentality, but I’d argue, if anything, we have a losers mentality when you see us play Celtic or rangers and that comes from the manager and his methods/approach. That’s hard to lose once you have it.

You say we are brilliant at closing out victories? Are we? Or do you mean his very negative, conservative, and extremely frustrating game management? Especially against the majority of teams in our league, sitting back and holding on for victory isn’t really necessary with the ability we have. I feel he takes it to extremes and we maybe scrape and hold on for a 2-1 win when it could and should have been 4 or 5 and he develop a killer instinct or bully mentality. 

I guess I answer my own question here but his style is more negative than positive to me now. It got us ‘success’ when rangers, hearts, hibs, Dundee United etc were all fucked financially and terrible, but what now?

The teams you're talking about take their style (or what they like to tell people is their style) from the club, not the manager. It transcends the manager. If the dons want to do that, that's fine. Ferguson's team "had a chip on the shoulder attitude"? That's not a style. Most of the styles you mention aren't styles either, they're really just tactics. Most teams in the league would disagree we're a bit soft too, we're fairly dominant in games and quite physical. Hoban, Taylor, Considine, Ferguson, McRorie, Leigh, Cosgrove are not shy in the physical side of the game. 

Yes, we're brilliant at closing out victories, that's just a demonstrable fact. I don't think we've lost a game this year where we've been ahead but I'd have to check. We rarely lose leads. Game management, as you say, being the style, which is the question you asked. Grim at times, but we've taken a lot of points on the back of it. 

You say it's negative, I say its pragmatic. When he buys shite players, he shitefests the games to make up for it, grinding out points that previous managers - and other SPFL managers (Lennon at Hibs a prime example) - would not have. To have won so many games with a loser's mentality is fairly spectacular. 

Point of order: there was no financial fuckedness with utd or hibs, they just had managers that got them relegated by being shite. That was their "success".

[LA-Don]

2 hours ago, RicoS321 said:

The teams you're talking about take their style (or what they like to tell people is their style) from the club, not the manager. It transcends the manager. If the dons want to do that, that's fine. Ferguson's team "had a chip on the shoulder attitude"? That's not a style. Most of the styles you mention aren't styles either, they're really just tactics. Most teams in the league would disagree we're a bit soft too, we're fairly dominant in games and quite physical. Hoban, Taylor, Considine, Ferguson, McRorie, Leigh, Cosgrove are not shy in the physical side of the game. 

Yes, we're brilliant at closing out victories, that's just a demonstrable fact. I don't think we've lost a game this year where we've been ahead but I'd have to check. We rarely lose leads. Game management, as you say, being the style, which is the question you asked. Grim at times, but we've taken a lot of points on the back of it. 

You say it's negative, I say its pragmatic. When he buys shite players, he shitefests the games to make up for it, grinding out points that previous managers - and other SPFL managers (Lennon at Hibs a prime example) - would not have. To have won so many games with a loser's mentality is fairly spectacular. 

Point of order: there was no financial fuckedness with utd or hibs, they just had managers that got them relegated by being shite. That was their "success".

The loser mentality is relating to the way we usually approach the old firm games, I don’t think you can argue that. Polar opposite from Ferguson and there have been winnable games we’ve shit the bed and have been unnecessarily defensive, borderline scared. For the most part we sit back defensively, more Celtic than rangers, and inevitably lose. It’s maybe been less so of late but I still feel it’s hard for DM to change the players mindset from his negative tactics of many old firm games.

I don’t think it’s pragmatic to hold out for one goal wins against lower opposition, holding out for a 2-1 win over Hamilton Ross county or the likes. We’re not a similar team with similar players grinding out a win. We’ve had better players and the manager has held us back in games we could have won more convincingly in my eyes. We don’t put teams away when we had the talent to do so.

I don’t fully agree the club dictates a style. Yes, some do, it’s attack attack attack at man United but arsenal under George graham were very different to Wenger’s arsenal. Barca changed too. I just feel after 8 years mcinnes should have achieved more with the quality of product on the field. He’s had the talent and the money to spend, more than everyone bar the old firm. It’s not like our players are actually shite, these are pro players with talent, better and more skilled than we probably believe. One trophy in 8 years isn’t enough to me, and it’s regression on the field right now and has been for a while. And the way we play should positively reflect a manager who has been at a club for almost a decade.

I do feel we are soft deep down, and our manager is soft. We have folded in tough games and our manager has shat it. Yes we’ve bullied little guys in our league in the past, but i’m not talking about that, i’m more ambitious and I don’t think I’m unrealistic.

[RicoS321]

6 hours ago, LA-Don said:

The loser mentality is relating to the way we usually approach the old firm games, I don’t think you can argue that. Polar opposite from Ferguson and there have been winnable games we’ve shit the bed and have been unnecessarily defensive, borderline scared. For the most part we sit back defensively, more Celtic than rangers, and inevitably lose. It’s maybe been less so of late but I still feel it’s hard for DM to change the players mindset from his negative tactics of many old firm games.

I don’t think it’s pragmatic to hold out for one goal wins against lower opposition, holding out for a 2-1 win over Hamilton Ross county or the likes. We’re not a similar team with similar players grinding out a win. We’ve had better players and the manager has held us back in games we could have won more convincingly in my eyes. We don’t put teams away when we had the talent to do so.

I don’t fully agree the club dictates a style. Yes, some do, it’s attack attack attack at man United but arsenal under George graham were very different to Wenger’s arsenal. Barca changed too. I just feel after 8 years mcinnes should have achieved more with the quality of product on the field. He’s had the talent and the money to spend, more than everyone bar the old firm. It’s not like our players are actually shite, these are pro players with talent, better and more skilled than we probably believe. One trophy in 8 years isn’t enough to me, and it’s regression on the field right now and has been for a while. And the way we play should positively reflect a manager who has been at a club for almost a decade.

I do feel we are soft deep down, and our manager is soft. We have folded in tough games and our manager has shat it. Yes we’ve bullied little guys in our league in the past, but i’m not talking about that, i’m more ambitious and I don’t think I’m unrealistic.

I don't disagree with a lot of that, I'm just struggling to see what it's got to do with a style. I think you've thrown a bunch of other stuff in the mix that has nothing to do with style. Over an eight year period, I don't think you can have a consistent style. With our turnover of players, and the varying degree of quality of our signings, it would be impossible. McInnes has generally been good, eventually, each year of finding a setup that gets results and going on a good run of point building to maintain a strong league position. Unless we get a striker in the next few days, I don't think he'll manage that this year. The setup with Watkins was enough to win us games. He needs to pick a setup this week and stick with it or we'll be heavily relying on luck.

[Chris Frae Killie]

I appreciate that this season we haven't clicked in the forward areas when it comes to goals, however, just a question to those that say McInnes plays negative football and we are too defensive - how can you call playing a starting line up with two out and out wingers (Hayes and Kennedy), a number 10 (Scott Wright), a centre forward (Sam Cosgrove) and another winger/forward (Ryan Hedges) defensive? I could understand if we had Logan and Leigh playing in the wide positions and we effectively had 5 defenders on the pitch but we effectively have 5 attacking players and I would argue that Ferguson and McCrorie are both box to box midfielders, rather than defensive midfielders so really we only have 4 (If you include Lewis) truly defensive players in our usual starting line up. I just think that a number of factors have contributed to our lack of goals and consistency this season - injuries (we've had plenty) suspensions, player ineligibility and match postponements etc. We have not been able to get a flow and rhythm going. We are creating chances but just not finishing them. If we were going through matches with a handful of half chances, I would be worried and very unhappy, however, we are creating and creating a lot. I believe, had Cosgrove been on 75% of the form he was on last season and the season before, we would be ahead of Celtic right now. One thing which I do feel we have been extremely disappointing at, and I blame the manager and coaching staff along with the players, is scoring from corners. We have had SO many corners this season and I think we have scored less than a handful. We have a big team, so there is no excuse for that statistic.

[RedStarTorphins]

Get him to f**k

Cormack needs to find a way to get rid. Asap

[Jute]

Just now, RedStarTorphins said:

Get him to f**k

Cormack needs to find a way to get rid. Asap

Just cannot see us paying him off in current circumstances. Think he is here to the summer at least. 

[manc_don]

Has he lost the dressing room? Didn't seem like they were playing for him, let alone with any intensity.

[ayrshire_don74]

there hasnt been intensity since shinnie left

[RedStarTorphins]

54 minutes ago, Jute said:

Just cannot see us paying him off in current circumstances. Think he is here to the summer at least. 

I agree, but he has to go in the summer.

Lots of changes in the playing squad & he’d only make a mess of it. 
 

[manc_don]

10 hours ago, RedStarTorphins said:

I agree, but he has to go in the summer.

Lots of changes in the playing squad & he’d only make a mess of it. 
 

I think that's the most important thing. We don't trust him, it would appear the board don't trust him either (hence purse strings firmly closed this Jan). We're a mess at the moment, at a time when we should be capitalising on other teams weaknesses.  It's frustrating as fuck.

[RedStarTorphins]

19 minutes ago, manc_don said:

I think that's the most important thing. We don't trust him, it would appear the board don't trust him either (hence purse strings firmly closed this Jan). We're a mess at the moment, at a time when we should be capitalising on other teams weaknesses.  It's frustrating as fuck.

In a season where 2nd and a Champions League spot was spot was definitely achievable, we could be 5th the way we’re playing.

That alone, regardless of the atrocious football served up, should be seen as sackable. 

[mini59dons]

Its finally Time....

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/feb/02/stuart-baxter-sacked-by-indian-football-club-odisha-after-using-analogy

 

[baggy89]

1 hour ago, mini59dons said:

Its finally Time....

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/feb/02/stuart-baxter-sacked-by-indian-football-club-odisha-after-using-analogy

 

Beaten too it... 

[LA-Don]

http://www.facebook.com/whatastramash

Not sure people will be able to access, interesting read.

[manc_don]

Quite "liked" if that's the right word, his latest post. Hits the nail on the head really and is exactly what a lot of us are thinking.

[LA-Don]

1 hour ago, manc_don said:

Quite "liked" if that's the right word, his latest post. Hits the nail on the head really and is exactly what a lot of us are thinking.

I thought it was accurate. For those who can access, it’s the article titled ‘A deep rooted malaise with no end in sight.’

[Jute]

I couldn’t get initial link to work but found this. 
 

https://www.whatastramash.com/home/2021/2/3/malaise

Pretty well written but most of the points have been raised here and elsewhere about McInnes. As I said above I do not see anything happening until the summer at the earliest due to current financial restraints. 

[Panda]

Tom English going public on the rumours that defeat on Saturday might end McInnes' reign 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/55939909

[tup1]

Stephen Robinson to be the new manager.

[Jute]

9 minutes ago, tup1 said:

Stephen Robinson to be the new manager.

Really hope not.