Jute Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 That was all on Goodwin and his second half substitutions. There were individual errors by usual suspects on the goals but in the main the manger has blown this game. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrlandoDon Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 (edited) I’m not disappointed or gutted. Just angry. Saw it coming on Saturday and again tonight. We’re weak defensively and sit back against the best two teams in the league we’ll lose. seriously looks like over the winter break goodwin has become mcinnes. And there’s a reason we sacked him. ideal game to bring Ramirez on, but how do you counter attack with no forward for 30 mins? We looked like a kids team in attack, dribble or kick ball for the last 30 mins, both resulting in us losing the ball. Criminal the Morris run that finished with a cross to nobody when we desperately needed to keep the ball upfield and Morris easily could have done. Right before their second goal too. ramadani was good tonight, but needs help. Can’t get over it though, managers subs and tactics cost us. Morris should never play, Watkins isn’t a center or attacking mid. The lack of depth at center mid killed us today too. Edited December 20, 2022 by OrlandoDon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrshire_don74 Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 barron was shite another charlatan looks like another failure like campbell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panda Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 I've had a few beers. Will probably reply to myself in an hour and accuse myself of talking shite. I said to my mates at half-time "if we take Stewart & Richardson off and replace them with actual footballers we might win this". Of course they were liable for all three goals. Ramadani, Barron, Clarkson. For every good thing they'll do, they'll repay it with something poor. All three have great potential though, I tend to think a good manager/coaches would take them up a level. I don't think we have either of those at the club. Duk & Coulson kept us in the game tonight. McCrorie was the only defender who could actually defend. But again he's wasted back there. I'll defend Watkins though, who is getting a lot of stick I see on Twitter. Thought he looked rusty, but got himself involved far more than Miovski did, won free-kicks, and I'd start him at St Mirren. But we were so deep he was essentially deployed as a central midfielder. Goodwin. I'm fast losing faith in him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 Even if he was correct from a tactical point of view (he wasn’t), why would you bring on Morris ahead of Besuijen and Duncan? Ramirez would have offered more than Watkins too but Goodwin obviously still hasn’t proven his male dominance over him just quite yet. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrlandoDon Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 Someone please explain the subs? Mackenzie for coulson I get. Why morris instead of Vinny or Duncan? Seen nothing to suggest, defensively or in attack, that morris can do more. In fact, we’ve all seen morris is total shite and has nothing to offer. I’m not wrong here. surely to defend for 30 mins you do need a forward. Why not Ramirez for miovski, at least to give some sort of attacking threat?? This is up there with levein and his 4-6-0 game. I can understand Watkins for duk, speed and physical play to support the attack. But there was no attack to support and he had nowhere to go when he got the ball. lastly, maybe it’s just me, but bringing on 3 subs at once, especially with a tactical change. That’s tough to adapt with new tactics and personnel changes all at once. I’m sober and totally stunned with our subs and tactical changes when the game for the most part had gone well up until that point. I cannot understand what explanation goodwin can say??? Baffled that he fucked this up so badly. Really badly on the back of a huge embarrassment against Celtic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RicoS321 Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 37 minutes ago, Panda said: I'll defend Watkins though, who is getting a lot of stick I see on Twitter. Thought he looked rusty, but got himself involved far more than Miovski did, Just back. Agree with the above, Watkins was fine. It was almost like Goodwin saw them making four subs, so thought he'd better do a few too. Watkins and Hayes, absolutely fine. Keep Duk high up the pitch, and have Watkins deeper getting in people's faces. Morris is a honking footballer, but he also doesn't have the experience to do the intelligent thing. At least Hayes bought us a couple of fouls. However, it wasn't just the subs, we utterly shat the bed in a way I've never seen before. We panicked and then panicked again and completely lost our shape and plan. Ramadani was zonally marking, whilst Hayes and Coulson/McKenzie were attempting to man mark. Every time they went out wide they had an extra man. It was nothing like the organised approach we saw at the weekend and it's exceptionally difficult to change into that mode during the game, which it seems like we attempted. Stewart, and Goodwin, were shouting for the team to push up the park throughout that second half until about the 85th minute, when we suddenly stopped and sat in. We looked completely in control playing high(ish), and they were regularly passing out of play. Richardson is really bad. I've never seen a player with such low confidence. In the first half he didn't have the confidence to beat his man. In the second half he didn't have the confidence to deal with the ball in front of goal, just completely panicked. It isn't just that though, he doesn't put in the work. He tanked up the line in the second half and then just strolled back about 20 yards behind his man. You'd never have seen Logan, for example, be that negligent. Of you're shite at football (foster, say) then you at least have to use the athletic gifts you've been endowed with. It's like he's not fit. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RicoS321 Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 7 minutes ago, OrlandoDon said: surely to defend for 30 mins you do need a forward. In fairness, Watkins has played most of his games for the dons as a number nine. He's more than capable of leading the line in a game like this, but he needs at least one player close to him. I'd have kept Duk on and just played Watkins deeper, whilst firing Morris into the north sea. Hayes was clearly told to go on and sit deep, as he was virtually on top of McKenzie and Morris was just Morris. I really don't get it either. Although we should still have held on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panda Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 32 minutes ago, OrlandoDon said: I’m sober I take that personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedKev Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 Barron needs benched. Last 3 out of 4 goals, he's lost his man and giving too much space for them to shoot. Drop Barron, put MacKenzie on and have either Hayes or Coulson left mid. McRorie was constantly shouting at Richardson to get into a better position. RB is a major worry!! Grumpy this morning after that!!!...shame was shaping up to be a fantastic victory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc_don Posted December 21, 2022 Author Share Posted December 21, 2022 Jet lag got the better of me, managed to watch the first half and genuinely thought I’d be waking to a victory as I didn’t see us losing it. WTAF? losing what faith I had in Goodwin quickly. Doesn’t seem to be developing us at all. I get we had a lot of change, but I’m not seeing the hall marks of a personality. Mentally, the huns will have the edge over us at Hampden now too, which will be a hard enough game on its own given our away record. I did enjoy Duks goal, very clever routine and the sexual predator was done. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RicoS321 Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, RedKev said: Barron needs benched. Last 3 out of 4 goals, he's lost his man and giving too much space for them to shoot. I think that's extremely harsh. Barron was very good against the Tims until he switched off for a second, and he played well for long periods last night. When other people switch off, Barron is the one who comes across to cover almost every single time. When Barron makes an error, nobody is mopping up. Hayes was skinned by Kent for his shot last night and Barron was the one attempting to come across to block, when arguably Ramadani should have been better placed. Wright made a massive difference to their attack when he came on, his movement is extremely good (far more so than his end product), and we were being dragged left to right by him and Kent. We lost our shape completely. Barron was constantly having to look over his shoulder, because McRorie was having to mark Richardson to make sure he didn't provide them with an assist. The subs were poor last night, but it wouldn't be fair to suggest that we could have just continued playing the same way. It seems that fans and pundits ignore the effect of one team on the other. They made tactical changes and threw players forward. It's not a simple case of saying that we sat in, they pushed us back too. If we'd kept Duk on, or took on Vinny or Duncan instead of Morris we could have held them higher up the park in my opinion. However, if we'd had a usable defensive midfielder or another defender on the bench, sitting in would also have likely worked. We have real personnel problems. There's only so long you can get away with that and it's a shame that these two fixtures came in quick succession before the window. We need a couple of signings before the cup game to give us a chance. Edited December 21, 2022 by RicoS321 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 1 hour ago, RicoS321 said: We need a couple of signings before the cup game to give us a chance. Huns one, Darvel one or both Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wokinginashearerwonderland Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 It’s very harsh to blame Goodwin. I did wonder what he was playing at taking off our three main threats with half an hour left but that had nothing to do with the result and is a different debate. Last night was down to pure bottle and failure to handle the occasion. No way any team should be losing two goals in the 95th and 97th minutes. Saturday was a different story because Celtic were pushing and pushing and will do that to a lot of teams but don’t hang the manager out to dry because his players bottled it last night. That was nothing to do with tactics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 I deliberately stayed off here and social media during and after the match last night During the match as I didn't want to tempt fate by crowing about us winning. I've been on this journey many many times in recent times, and lo and behold here we go with another one. Post match, well I was just so fucking angry, but not sure who I was most angry with, Goodwin, the players or Willie "fucking" Collum. When I went to my bed, about midnight, I still couldn't switch off from going over and over the way that last half hour panned out. This morning in the cold light of day, I'm still not certain exactly who I'm most angry with but as many of you have highlighted the substitutions were non sensical. Four points out of six against the erse cheeks would have been a decent enough return. The manner in which we manged to turn four into sweet fuck all in the final minutes of both games is shocking. Been a long time since I've felt just so angry about the manner of defeat. Onward to Paisley on Saturday and then Killie on Wednesday. Neither of these are going to be a given. Saints will be up for this given the return of Goodwin and a McInnes managed Killie team are going to beat us some time. Could this run of fixtures fallen any worse. Won't be surprised to see us out with top six by the new year with teams bunching up behind us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panda Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 1 hour ago, wokinginashearerwonderland said: It’s very harsh to blame Goodwin. I did wonder what he was playing at taking off our three main threats with half an hour left but that had nothing to do with the result and is a different debate. Last night was down to pure bottle and failure to handle the occasion. No way any team should be losing two goals in the 95th and 97th minutes. Saturday was a different story because Celtic were pushing and pushing and will do that to a lot of teams but don’t hang the manager out to dry because his players bottled it last night. If you're going to criticise the players' bottle, then you criticise Goodwin as well. He basically drilled into them on Saturday that we had no chance of winning the game. We were time wasting in the first half in that one, made no effort to try and win it. Three days later the players aren't suddenly going to shift and believe they are good enough to beat one of the Old Firm. We were more progressive last night - they had to be - but the players going into their shell and retreating to their own box is the mentality in the team just now. The distinct lack of leaders in the team is down to Goodwin too. He got rid of Brown, rid of Considine, his treatment of Ramirez is unwarranted. He's created a young team who won't answer back to him. 1 hour ago, wokinginashearerwonderland said: That was nothing to do with tactics. So you think Goodwin got his tactics correct last night? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrlandoDon Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 1 hour ago, wokinginashearerwonderland said: It’s very harsh to blame Goodwin. I did wonder what he was playing at taking off our three main threats with half an hour left but that had nothing to do with the result and is a different debate. Last night was down to pure bottle and failure to handle the occasion. No way any team should be losing two goals in the 95th and 97th minutes. Saturday was a different story because Celtic were pushing and pushing and will do that to a lot of teams but don’t hang the manager out to dry because his players bottled it last night. That was nothing to do with tactics. It has absolutely everything to do with goodwin. We were fine until the 65th minute or so when he subbed, went with no forwards, and changed tactics. That changed the game and it was his doing. Who else can you blame?? after the second goal we should have gone with our strength, which is more attack than defend. Be brave. The Huns were there for the taking at that point. Going with no forwards and sitting back suited them perfectly and just like the Celtic game, it was only a matter of time before they scored. last night was also a game where experience was needed. Bring on Ramirez who would have offered so much more than morris and put wadkins wide. That’s a no brainer to me. Again, Goodwin’s call. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 5 hours ago, RedKev said: Barron needs benched. Last 3 out of 4 goals, he's lost his man and giving too much space for them to shoot. Drop Barron, put MacKenzie on and have either Hayes or Coulson left mid. McRorie was constantly shouting at Richardson to get into a better position. RB is a major worry!! Grumpy this morning after that!!!...shame was shaping up to be a fantastic victory. Barron's away next month Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc_don Posted December 21, 2022 Author Share Posted December 21, 2022 4 hours ago, BigAl said: Barron's away next month Where’s he off to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redordead Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 4 hours ago, BigAl said: Barron's away next month Funny you should say that. I feel that our focus isn't on winning games but on selling players. Barron being one who they clearly want to get as much game time as possible and also miovski who the board keep touting about as being worth a fortune despite his. Hopefully they're trying to put Morris in the shop window too. Only way to explain his recent inclusion. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 5 minutes ago, manc_don said: Where’s he off to? Another club Genuinely don't know mate, but do believe he is playing out time. If we get seven figures for him, snatch their fingers off. The bhoy has believed his hype. Time to sign a contract with Adidas but not us When all is said and done he has played less than thirty first team games for us. P.S And if someone was stupid enough to offer us £4m for Miovski then can I volunteer to drive him to the channel ferry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc_don Posted December 21, 2022 Author Share Posted December 21, 2022 2 hours ago, BigAl said: Another club Genuinely don't know mate, but do believe he is playing out time. If we get seven figures for him, snatch their fingers off. The bhoy has believed his hype. Time to sign a contract with Adidas but not us When all is said and done he has played less than thirty first team games for us. P.S And if someone was stupid enough to offer us £4m for Miovski then can I volunteer to drive him to the channel ferry. I wasn’t sure if we were allowed to have opinions like that, but certainly the impression i got. Reeks of Fraser. Which is a shame but there we go. Had heard the Tims were interested, but then a Tim mate of mine who’s usually fairly well clued up had no idea about him 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 Opinions make life interesting Manc. We are all entitled to them. Sometimes I am wary of voicing mine, but right now fuck them, I am calling them out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jute Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 53 minutes ago, manc_don said: I wasn’t sure if we were allowed to have opinions like that, but certainly the impression i got. Reeks of Fraser. Which is a shame but there we go. Had heard the Tims were interested, but then a Tim mate of mine who’s usually fairly well clued up had no idea about him Would that be one of your mates you did the huddle with? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc_don Posted December 22, 2022 Author Share Posted December 22, 2022 9 hours ago, Jute said: Would that be one of your mates you did the huddle with? Actually yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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